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Roth 401k - early disbursement
Posted on 12/6/16 at 11:18 am
Posted on 12/6/16 at 11:18 am
Employer just announced that they are suspending 401k contribution matching. I have a Roth 401k that uses after-tax dollars, and after 5 years I have seen a roughly 5% return.
My understanding of the rules of Roth 401k is that I can do an early disbursement of the account, and will owe 10% penalty plus tax on the earnings of the account. Unless I'm way off, the penalty and tax only apply to the 5% return in the account.
Is that correct? Would I be better served taking control of this myself, considering the "aggressive" fund that I was in netted a 5% return with the market at all-time highs?
My understanding of the rules of Roth 401k is that I can do an early disbursement of the account, and will owe 10% penalty plus tax on the earnings of the account. Unless I'm way off, the penalty and tax only apply to the 5% return in the account.
Is that correct? Would I be better served taking control of this myself, considering the "aggressive" fund that I was in netted a 5% return with the market at all-time highs?
Posted on 12/6/16 at 11:33 am to jmcwhrter
Correct. You can withdrawal what you have contributed penalty free. That money has already been taxed. The penalty applies when you withdrawal your earnings, which haven't been taxed.
This post was edited on 12/6/16 at 11:35 am
Posted on 12/6/16 at 12:20 pm to jmcwhrter
5% over the last 5 years? Good gawwwd that's awful. Are there no other better performing fund choices? And no Match? Good lord yes leave that plan in the dust and probably consider moving on from that company too.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 12:32 pm to jmcwhrter
quote:
Unless I'm way off, the penalty and tax only apply to the 5% return in the account.
The penalty and tax only apply to anything that is more than what was contributed. For example, suppose over the years you contributed $10000 and your company kicked in another $1000 on top of that that is vested. You can withdraw up to $11000 without any penalty. Anything more than that is subject to taxes and penalties.
Or ... you could just roll it over to a Roth IRA and pay no penalty or tax at all. That's usually the best way to go.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 1:32 pm to foshizzle
Sounds like there is no separation of employment so he's not eligible to roll this over unless his plan allows for an inservice rollover.
It would not be wise to cash out of a 401k bc of poor performance, it would be wise however to re-evaluate your plans investment options if you truly have only realized a 5% TOTAL return.
It would not be wise to cash out of a 401k bc of poor performance, it would be wise however to re-evaluate your plans investment options if you truly have only realized a 5% TOTAL return.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 2:31 pm to Shepherd88
OP, I don't see how its possible to have only a 5% total return in 5 years? Are you invested in some type of actively managed fund? Have you withdrawn money or otherwise lost it somehow?
If you aren't, I'd be on the phone trying to figure out whats going on?
If you aren't, I'd be on the phone trying to figure out whats going on?
Posted on 12/6/16 at 3:33 pm to foshizzle
quote:
you contributed $10000 and your company kicked in another $1000 on top of that that is vested
quote:
You can withdraw up to $11000 without any penalty
Aren't most matching contributions made on a pre-tax basis, even if the employee is contributing after-tax? I thought only the $10k would be penalty free.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 3:55 pm to Brummy
I thought if u rolled to a Roth you are still subject to taxes and penalty.
Rolling to a traditional ira bypasses the penalties
Rolling to a traditional ira bypasses the penalties
Posted on 12/7/16 at 9:21 am to Brummy
quote:
Aren't most matching contributions made on a pre-tax basis, even if the employee is contributing after-tax? I thought only the $10k would be penalty free.
You're correct, only the employee contribution is post tax, employer match is pre tax just like a regular 401k. A Roth 401K segregates these 2 employee/employer components, which can be rolled over to a Roth IRA and rollover IRA, respectively, without penalty.
Not sure on the rules for qualifying for a rollover though on the employer match portion. I imagine if you're not participating going forward, you could rollover to a self directed traditional rollover IRA. The Roth 401k would work the same, it's just a Roth IRA on steroids (higher contribution limit, no income limitation) unless the investment choice is poor and expenses high. You should be printing money over the last ~4 years in even the most basic index fund.
Edit: I recommend everybody have a rollover IRA you control at a quality brokerage (Vanguard, Fidelity, etc.) where you can put all your accumulated qualified plan contributions over your career. No sense in leaving your money with someone who doesn't have your interest first.
This post was edited on 12/7/16 at 9:33 am
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