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T-Bob blew it and why Crowton might be worse than you think
Posted by GOP_Tiger on 10/5/10 at 11:12 pm00
Amidst all the adulation for T-Bob Hebert for "saving" LSU by having the sense to snap the ball, I am going to present a contrary viewpoint -- that he blew it and nearly cost LSU the game.
The play was going to be a pass play. There are trips left and Terrence Toliver is in the slot and headed for the left corner of the end zone, while Deangelo Peterson is going straight up from the TE position on the other side. It appears to me that the play to Toliver is the primary read if the defensive alignment is favorable and that the route to Peterson is the alternate call if one of the DBs is playing back.
With six seconds left, Jefferson is giving the call to the line and Ridley. At five seconds, Jefferson is glancing at the WRs on the left and looking at the coverage. Ridley and Hurst are not set. At four seconds, Jefferson begins his cadence for the snap. At three seconds, Jefferson appears to be in the process of starting to stamp his leg to call for the ball, as a QB would in a visiting stadium, because the crowd noise would likely prevent his cadence from being heard. At this time, it appears to me that Jefferson is quickly looking at the defense in front of him to assess whether Peterson is likely to be open in the event that the play to Toliver isn't there.
I believe T-Bob panicked and simply snapped the ball too early. To me, Jefferson seems aware of the clock, and there was no way that his cadence was going to last three more seconds. Contrary to popular opinion, it appears that T-Bob, rather than Jefferson, is the one who lacked clock awareness.
It does not matter whether the ball is snapped with three seconds left or one -- it was going to be the last play of the game in any case.
The interesting thing is that the play was going to "work" in that Toliver was going to be open. Neither he nor the DB opposite him see the bad snap, and Toliver jukes him and would have been wide open in the corner.
Reviewing this has made me much more infuriated with Gary Crowton. For a second, please disregard the fact that he sent Jefferson in with only one play instead of two. Disregard the fact that Crowton then substitutes players when there is no time to do so, and this effectively costs us a down (because if we don't sub, we have time for a quick pass play and then another play if that doesn't work).
No, I want you to focus on the fact that the two best goal-line plays that Crowton could come up with were a Jefferson run off tackle and a pass from Jefferson to Toliver. Think about the futility of Jefferson as a pure runner. Think about Jefferson's pass completion percentage. Think about the fact that Toliver drops everything Jefferson throws to him (though he seems to be able to catch Lee's passes just fine).
What confidence do any of you have that Jefferson-to-Toliver in the end zone results in a completed pass?
The play was going to be a pass play. There are trips left and Terrence Toliver is in the slot and headed for the left corner of the end zone, while Deangelo Peterson is going straight up from the TE position on the other side. It appears to me that the play to Toliver is the primary read if the defensive alignment is favorable and that the route to Peterson is the alternate call if one of the DBs is playing back.
With six seconds left, Jefferson is giving the call to the line and Ridley. At five seconds, Jefferson is glancing at the WRs on the left and looking at the coverage. Ridley and Hurst are not set. At four seconds, Jefferson begins his cadence for the snap. At three seconds, Jefferson appears to be in the process of starting to stamp his leg to call for the ball, as a QB would in a visiting stadium, because the crowd noise would likely prevent his cadence from being heard. At this time, it appears to me that Jefferson is quickly looking at the defense in front of him to assess whether Peterson is likely to be open in the event that the play to Toliver isn't there.
I believe T-Bob panicked and simply snapped the ball too early. To me, Jefferson seems aware of the clock, and there was no way that his cadence was going to last three more seconds. Contrary to popular opinion, it appears that T-Bob, rather than Jefferson, is the one who lacked clock awareness.
It does not matter whether the ball is snapped with three seconds left or one -- it was going to be the last play of the game in any case.
The interesting thing is that the play was going to "work" in that Toliver was going to be open. Neither he nor the DB opposite him see the bad snap, and Toliver jukes him and would have been wide open in the corner.
Reviewing this has made me much more infuriated with Gary Crowton. For a second, please disregard the fact that he sent Jefferson in with only one play instead of two. Disregard the fact that Crowton then substitutes players when there is no time to do so, and this effectively costs us a down (because if we don't sub, we have time for a quick pass play and then another play if that doesn't work).
No, I want you to focus on the fact that the two best goal-line plays that Crowton could come up with were a Jefferson run off tackle and a pass from Jefferson to Toliver. Think about the futility of Jefferson as a pure runner. Think about Jefferson's pass completion percentage. Think about the fact that Toliver drops everything Jefferson throws to him (though he seems to be able to catch Lee's passes just fine).
What confidence do any of you have that Jefferson-to-Toliver in the end zone results in a completed pass?
quote:
At this time, it appears to me that Jefferson is quickly looking at the defense in front of him to assess whether Peterson is likely to be open in the event that the play to Toliver isn't there.
And at this point, JJ was looking over at the sidelines to me.
quote:
At this time, it appears to me that Jefferson is quickly looking at the defense in front of him to assess whether Peterson is likely to be open in the event that the play to Toliver isn't there.
All I need to re-confirm for me that Hebert did indeed save the game for us. If I have to choose between Jefferson reading a D and throwing the ball and Hebert just wildly snapping the ball with the hope something works out...I'll take the latter. In a second.
re: T-Bob blew it and why Crowton might be worse than you thinkPosted by BestDamnTigerFan on 10/5/10 at 11:18 pm to GOP_Tiger
quote:
What confidence do any of you have that Jefferson-to-Toliver in the end zone results in a completed pass?
ZERO!
re: T-Bob blew it and why Crowton might be worse than you thinkPosted by DanglingFury on 10/5/10 at 11:18 pm to Duckie
quote:
it appears to me that Jefferson is quickly looking at the defense in front of him to assess whether Peterson is likely to be open in the event that the play to Toliver isn't there.
That would be two reads. No chance.
re: T-Bob blew it and why Crowton might be worse than you thinkPosted by CamdenTiger on 10/5/10 at 11:19 pm to TN Bhoy
quote:
What confidence do any of you have that Jefferson-to-Toliver in the end zone results in a completed pass?
<50% because TT has been using boards for hands the past few weeks.
I thought the same thing on 4th and 15, but TT proved me wrong. I think the passing game will improve with Lee, however. The play with JJ, is a toss-up(pun intended).
quote:
It appears to me that the play to Toliver is the primary read if the defensive alignment is favorable and that the route to Peterson is the alternate call if one of the DBs is playing back.
You know, you might have a fricking point if not for the fact that Tennessee had TWO EXTRA DEFENDERS.
Which, by the way, wouldn't matter if T-Bob hadn't snapped the ball before time expired. The ref immediately asked the replay official if the ball had been snapped before time expired. Because if time expired, Tennessee would have won and never have been penalized for having too many men.
So I ask you, just what play do you think we should have run to score against 13 defenders???
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quote:
If I have to choose between Jefferson reading a D and throwing the ball and Hebert just wildly snapping the ball with the hope something works out...I'll take the latter. In a second.
That isn't the choice. If Hebert doesn't panic and gives Jefferson one more second to finish his cadence, then we have a free play. If the throw to Toliver doesn't work, there is still the penalty flag.
re: T-Bob blew it and why Crowton might be worse than you thinkPosted by TigerNlc on 10/5/10 at 11:22 pm to DanglingFury
He had 3 completions and 2 interceptions. There is nothing to leave me to believe they would have converted it. I wonder if anyone knew what to do on the play. TBob said he didn't even know what play was called.
re: T-Bob blew it and why Crowton might be worse than you thinkPosted by DanglingFury on 10/5/10 at 11:23 pm to GOP_Tiger
quote:
GOP_Tiger
Dude, nobody agrees with you. Let's just leave it at that.
re: T-Bob blew it and why Crowton might be worse than you thinkPosted by BRTiger2005 on 10/5/10 at 11:24 pm to GOP_Tiger
quote:
That isn't the choice. If Hebert doesn't panic and gives Jefferson one more second to finish his cadence, then we have a free play. If the throw to Toliver doesn't work, there is still the penalty flag.
So you really think he was 1 second away from calling from and receiving the ball? Just 1 second later and he would've been ready, huh?
quote:
At this time, it appears to me that Jefferson is quickly looking at the defense in front of him to assess whether Peterson is likely to be open in the event that the play to Toliver isn't there.
This is most likely false. I have yet to see him READ a defense well enough, let alone figure out Peterson would be the guy. Even so Jefferson would have had to been blind not to see how wide open Peterson was.
re: T-Bob blew it and why Crowton might be worse than you thinkPosted by fanofatiger on 10/5/10 at 11:28 pm to DanglingFury
les get off the board....
re: T-Bob blew it and why Crowton might be worse than you thinkPosted by GOP_Tiger on 10/5/10 at 11:29 pm to BRTiger2005
quote:You don't? Watch it carefully. What would make you think that his cadence was going to last three more seconds?
So you really think he was 1 second away from calling from and receiving the ball? Just 1 second later and he would've been ready, huh?
I'm not saying that Jefferson didn't make any mistakes in the sequence. He still should have clocked the ball to give the team time to prepare for the play properly. I'm just saying that he wasn't going to let time run out.
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