Question for Bapple about reloading: | TigerDroppings.com

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DanTiger
LSU Fan
Somewhere in Luziana
Member since Sep 2004
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Question for Bapple about reloading:


I am looking to get into reloading. Initially, I would like to focus on reloading for the 223 and 9mm mainly for plinking loads. I would like to keep everything as simple as possible to start and not have more components than needed? What are your thoughts on using rifle primers for the 9mm or pistol primers for the 223. Are they interchangeable? What about using one powder for both cartridges?







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civiltiger07
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Dec 2011
601 posts
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re: Question for Bapple about reloading:


HELL NO! DON'T DO IT

You should use the exact primer that the reloading data calls for. For example if the data uses a CCI No. 500 primer use that primer and no other.






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007mag
LSU Fan
Death Valley, Sec. 408
Member since Dec 2011
1826 posts

re: Question for Bapple about reloading:


Gonna be good





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Judge Smails
Michigan State Fan
Chasing Blue Duck
Member since Mar 2008
4075 posts
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re: Question for Bapple about reloading:


I don't know that rifle and pistol primers are interchangeable. The same powder could be possible though.





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FelicianaTigerfan
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2009
14089 posts

re: Question for Bapple about reloading:


Hang on, he's making a video





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NASA_ISS_Tiger
LSU Fan
Huntsville, Al via Sulphur, LA
Member since Sep 2005
4669 posts

re: Question for Bapple about reloading:


Rifle primers (Small Rifle primers) are for rifles. Small pistol primers are for pistols. I don't have the specs, but I'm sure the pocket sizes are different on the cases not to mention several other parameters.

Powder is different.There is round/ball, stick, and other types of powder. Get a reloading guide and you'll see the difference between 9mm and .223. By the way...good luck on finding primers and brass for two calibers.

Burn rates on powder is different...pressures are different...wrong powder...bad pressure...could result in a split brass or worse.






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chrisman17
New Orleans, LA
Member since Dec 2007
914 posts
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re: Question for Bapple about reloading:


There's a reason why there are pistol and rifle powders...





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ninthward
LSU Fan
Verdi,NV
Member since May 2007
5692 posts

re: Question for Bapple about reloading:


Certain SPP and SRP are interchangeable. I wont mention the two as I rarely give out load data online.
There is a TON of knowledge on this very subject online Google is your friend.









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ninthward
LSU Fan
Verdi,NV
Member since May 2007
5692 posts

re: Question for Bapple about reloading:


there really is not a powder that is interchangeable for those calibers, possible Trail Boss, but its best to buy just one for pistol and one for rifle.





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JJChamp
Auburn Fan
Birmingham
Member since Oct 2012
537 posts

re: Question for Bapple about reloading:


Keep your primers straight, the primer may fit but as others have said, the burn rate of the primer vs the powder could cause issues. Im not saying that they wont work, but I would not feel comfortable loading them.





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Buck_Rogers
Member since Jul 2013
181 posts

re: Question for Bapple about reloading:


quote:

Question for Bapple about reloading:
I tried watching that dude's videos on youtube. In my opinion, it is dangerous for him to even be posting his advice on youtube when it could damn well get someone killed. During his reloading tutorial, he actually switched to priming a 223 case becasue he did not have any primers for the 9mm case he originally started with. Believe me, you don't want his advice and you will see partially why. To answer your question though, when it comes to small rifle vs. small pistol primers, there are only two differences. Brisance and hardness. Brisance is a measure of the explosiveness of the primer. Hardness determines how much force is needed to ignite the primer. Since these two primers are dimensionally the same, they can safely be used interchangeably in some instances as long as caution is used. Rifle primers have more brisance and hardness than pistol primers. Magnum pistol primers are somewhere in the middle of both and can be a viable compromise. I’ll keep the discussion on both ends to keep it simple though.

I would not suggest using pistol primers in semi-auto or automatic rifles to prevent slamfires. Since pistol powders burn a little cooler than rifle primers, be careful of delayed ignitions. This is when the firing pin strikes the primer, but there is a delay in how long it takes to ignite the powder. If you run into this problem, wait 30 seconds before taking your rifle off target or unloading the cartridge. This usually is not a problem if you stick to the faster burning powders commonly used for 223 with 55 grain or less bullets. Another problem to watch out for is the rifle puncturing the pistol primers, since they are softer.

I think the better route to go is to use standard small rifle primers in both, granted your pistol is able to ignite the harder primers. Glocks and other striker fired pistols might have trouble in this department (I’m sure you are familiar with this by now). It should not be a problem with a strong hammer fired pistol, such as a Browning Hi Power. Just make sure to work up your load using the rifle primer, as switching from a pistol primer to a rifle primer normally increases pressure because of the increase in brisance.

Unique is a good all purpose shotgun and pistol powder commonly used for 9mm, but can be used in some rifle cartridges with good results for reduced loads and plinking purposes. I have had great results using Unique in my Remington 799 with 40 gr V-Max and 55 gr FMJ bullets. If I can recall right, without digging up my notes, I was able to obtain velocities with the V-Max around 2700 fps with 2.5” groups as the norm. 55 gr bullets were closer to 2200 fps and accuracy was about the same. Great plinking rounds if that is your intentions. I keep more Unique at hand than any other powder. It is a powder that has great versatility. It might not be the best in some cases, like rifle loads, but it can be made to work when in a bind.









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bapple
LSU Fan
Capital City
Member since Oct 2010
7089 posts

re: Question for Bapple about reloading:


quote:

What are your thoughts on using rifle primers for the 9mm or pistol primers for the 223. Are they interchangeable?


I have run small rifle primers in pistol calibers when I've had a surplus, but for the most part I keep them where they need to be and I don't suggest you do it.

I would NOT run small pistol primers in rifle cases though. The pressures are much higher so the thickness of rifle primers is greater. And as the new guy said the other day, pistol primers are purposely thinner than they used to be due to the advent of striker-fired pistols.

quote:

What about using one powder for both cartridges?


As previously stated, the burn rates are MUCH different.

My advice is to find a favorite powder for each respective cartridge and buy it in bulk. My favorites are:

.223/5.56: Hogdgon CFE223
9mm: Alliant Power Pistol
40 S&W: Winchester Super Target (WST)
45 ACP: Winchester Super Target (WST)
30-06: Hogdgon Superformance

Once you find something that works and doesn't have violent recoil, stick with it. Then figure out where the breaking point is in terms of pistol function if you really want to load for economy.

So for example, I worked up a load in 9mm from the very bottom, making 5 rounds per charge. I wanted to have enough powder to work the action and eject the cases reliably. Once I found the "breaking point" I tried it in all of my 9mms. I had to work up the round just a bit more to get it to work in my smaller guns (like my Kahr CM9). Once I was getting reliable ejection and feeding, I found the load I wanted and have been loading it the same ever since. The only thing that has changed has been availability of powder. If I have to load something else I will.

For rifles I usually load each round to a respective velocity, also depending on the weight of the round. I load 55gr rounds in 223 to about 3000fps (according to the data in the Hornady loading manual). For my 30-06, I load some 165gr rounds to about 2700fps. For rifles, powder charge is much more important in determining accuracy. If you don't care as much about accuracy and just want to plink in bulk, make sure the rounds function in your rifle (aka feeding and ejection) and you're good to go.

Hope this was helpful.



This post was edited on 8/21 at 2:41 pm


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weagle99
Member since Nov 2011
10870 posts
 Online 

re: Question for Bapple about reloading:


I think you need to buy some reloading manuals and spend some time studying before beginning to reload.

Not trying to sound like a dick, but problems can happen with reloading if you don't understand what is happening.



This post was edited on 8/21 at 3:01 pm


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Buck_Rogers
Member since Jul 2013
181 posts

re: Question for Bapple about reloading:


quote:

I have run small rifle primers in pistol calibers when I've had a surplus...
If that were the case, you would've known to do this on your youtube tutorial. You obviously just read what I posted and regurgitated it.
quote:

...but for the most part I keep them where they need to be and I don't suggest you do it.
Excuse me for being an a-hole for asking, but what are your reasons for this? Why was it ok for you to do, but not him?






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NASA_ISS_Tiger
LSU Fan
Huntsville, Al via Sulphur, LA
Member since Sep 2005
4669 posts

re: Question for Bapple about reloading:


Bapple:

What's your fav .223 primer?
Do you use the mil spec style or small rifle version?






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bapple
LSU Fan
Capital City
Member since Oct 2010
7089 posts

re: Question for Bapple about reloading:


quote:


What's your fav .223 primer?


My favorite brand of primers is CCI, period. I find they are consistent in many respects. They also have very few duds compared to some others.

I've had good success with Federal and Winchester as well, but CCI is my favorite. I usually just buy what I can find, especially now. I have found these 3 to all be just fine. I don't like Federals that much because the boxes their primers come in are way too big. It becomes a pain in the arse to store 2000 of them when they take up twice the space.

My least favorite are Remington and Tula, with Tula being the worst. I had a bunch of duds on my last run of Tula. I don't know if it had to do with the depth of the primer, or that it was loaded overseas or something, but they didn't work well at all for me. I've found that Remington primers don't seat as tightly into primer pockets, so they are just above Tula primers.

EDIT: I have found that Remington small pistol primers don't seat as tightly. I should've been more specific. I haven't used Remington small rifle, but Remington large rifle have been fine and my dad loads them in his deer hunting rounds.

quote:

Do you use the mil spec style or small rifle version?


Small rifle



This post was edited on 8/21 at 3:09 pm


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Choirboy
On your property
Member since Aug 2010
10695 posts

re: Question for Bapple about reloading:


I am disappoint

When I saw the thread title hours ago I didn't open it because I wanted there to be enough time for Buck N Bapple to get into an argument. I come here after several hours and Buck has only asked a few questions and apologized for being an a-hole one time.






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xenon16
LSU Fan
Metry Brah
Member since Sep 2008
2658 posts

re: Question for Bapple about reloading:


quote:

Why was it ok for you to do, but not him?


"Do as I say, not as I do..."

Heard this for years from my pops and use it to my kids too. I can take educated risks that they are not educated enough to do themselves.






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Buck_Rogers
Member since Jul 2013
181 posts

re: Question for Bapple about reloading:


Looks like Bapple refuses to answer my questions. I guess I hurt his feelings again.





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Buck_Rogers
Member since Jul 2013
181 posts

re: Question for Bapple about reloading:


quote:

Heard this for years from my pops and use it to my kids too. I can take educated risks that they are not educated enough to do themselves.
Yeah, but this is not Pops telling Junior what to do. I think everyone would like a real answer to this.






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