Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors - Page 4 - TigerDroppings.com

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ragincajun03
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re: Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors


While I support the idea of a voucher system (if my tax dollars must pay for another child's education, might as well have those dollars follow a kid to a good school), it's certainly not going to be a miracle worker.

(No evidence to the following statement, just throwing it out there from observation): I'd say 80-90% of a child's success/failure in education starts at the home. If they have a parent(s) who looks at schooling as simply a government-funded daycare from age 4-17, then it will still be tough for that child to succeed under such conditions.

However, I'd certainly like that child's chances better at a school that isn't over-run by unions and crooked bureaucrats.






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LSUfanalways
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Mar 2007
484 posts

re: Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors


quote:

Evidence lies in decisions of interested parties to participate in an environment best suited to their needs and ability.

Evidence lies in the choices families make when they actually possess resources required to freely make those choices.



LOL! So there's no evidence, is what you're saying. I agree.






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LSUfanalways
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Mar 2007
484 posts

re: Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors


quote:

Man there's a lot of mind readers in here.

They know Jindal's motives, his life plans, and where he spends all his time.







Touche. However, it's not difficult to know where the governor travels. He's an elected official and (unfortunately) the highest ranking official in our state. His travel record is a matter of public record.






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NC_Tigah
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Member since Sep 2003
51270 posts

re: Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors


quote:

If they have a parent(s) who looks at schooling as simply a government-funded daycare from age 4-17, then it will still be tough for that child to succeed under such conditions.

Exactly.
Vouchers are not a way out for all. But they are a way out for some. Those who chose to use vouchers would likely self-select for success. Perhaps for no reason other than not viewing school as "simply a government-funded daycare from age 4-17."






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NC_Tigah
LSU Fan
Member since Sep 2003
51270 posts

re: Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors


quote:

LOL! So there's no evidence, is what you're saying. I agree.
I appreciate the fact that you view as funny situations in which bright kids are limited in schools due to mismatched environment or offerings. Kids deprived of opportunity due to no fault of their own are apparently a great target of comedy. Funny stuff!

Again, there is a reason affluent families choose to send their kids to private school. Any insistence to the contrary is bizarre.






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Zach
LSU Fan
Member since May 2005
63468 posts

re: Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors


If you read Friedman's early thoughts on vouchers it's all about competition = improvement. Lack of competition = inefficiency and stagnation.

No K-12 system is going to well for students with low IQs or dysfunctional families. But look at the college system in the US. It's by far the best in the world. Why? Because of competition.

The tier I schools like Ivy League, MIT, Duke, etc can charge exorbitant fees because people want to go there. Colleges like LSU are in the middle range. There are brilliants students who wouldn't consider LSU. There are morons who cannot get into LSU.

There are niche schools like Bossier Comm College. You go there 2 years, figure out what you want to do and then either go to work or transfer to a four year school.

K-12, however, is based on geography. If you are in the district you must go to the public school or pay for private. The public school thus has no competition.

Same with salaries. At the college level Les Miles makes a LOT more money than the women's tennis coach. But in K-12 the best teacher in a school system makes the same salary as the worst teacher in that system. There is no competition.






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LSUfanalways
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Mar 2007
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re: Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors


quote:

LOL! So there's no evidence, is what you're saying. I agree.

I appreciate the fact that you view as funny situations in which bright kids are limited in schools due to mismatched environment or offerings. Kids deprived of opportunity due to no fault of their own are apparently a great target of comedy. Funny stuff!

Again, there is a reason affluent families choose to send their kids to private school. Any insistence to the contrary is bizarre.





I was actually laughing at your sophomoric statements. Kids are not limited in schools solely because of mismatched opportunities. Kids are limited in schools because lazy parents don't take the time to supplement education. Kids are in school for 8 hours a day; they are at home for 16 hours, yet it's all the school's fault or the "environment" that causes academic failure. Your stupid dramatic statements are what's comical.






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LSUfanalways
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Mar 2007
484 posts

re: Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors


quote:

LOL! So there's no evidence, is what you're saying. I agree.

I appreciate the fact that you view as funny situations in which bright kids are limited in schools due to mismatched environment or offerings. Kids deprived of opportunity due to no fault of their own are apparently a great target of comedy. Funny stuff!

Again, there is a reason affluent families choose to send their kids to private school. Any insistence to the contrary is bizarre.





Again, you have provided NO evidence that private schools are "better" than public schools. I see that you use idiotic statements such as "I appreciate the fact blah blah blah" to cover up the fact that you haven't a clue what you're talking about.






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LSUfanalways
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Mar 2007
484 posts

re: Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors


quote:

Again, there is a reason affluent families choose to send their kids to private school. Any insistence to the contrary is bizarre.



There's a reason, and it often has NOTHING to do with the school being a better school.






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Bestbank Tiger
Tulane Fan
Landmass
Member since Jan 2005
19420 posts

re: Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors


quote:

There's a reason, and it often has NOTHING to do with the school being a better school.


Yes. That reason is private schools don't have to coddle disruptive students with bogus "disabilities" (ie Oppositional Defiance Disorder). You don't know how to act and you're gone.






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I B Freeman
Member since Oct 2009
5456 posts

re: Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors


quote:

quote:
His voucher program is terrible idea.


Yeah, because the current system is working so well.


The problem with Jindal's voucher program is it is too limited. We should have vouchers for everybody and end this filtering of money through three or four government bureaucracies before it gets to the classroom.

Lets free these government school to operate as they should without political interference. Let them kick kids out if the kid don't perform. If parents have choice so will the schools. (You start ending these "baby sitter" schools and the parents will have a lot more interest in the kids education. If they lose free baby sitting services they might actually take some interest in their success. It is just STUPID to say vouchers won't work because parents don't care.)

I laugh when I hear these people say voucher are bad and we should stay with the current system. To them I say "St. Helena Central". Nothing in any voucher system would be as bad as that.

Jindal as I said earlier seems unwilling to go the distance on conservative ideas. He throws a little program out there to put it on his resume and then lets it die. Have you heard a single mention of any plans by Jindal to expand vouchers in 2013???



This post was edited on 2/16 at 11:32 am


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NC_Tigah
LSU Fan
Member since Sep 2003
51270 posts

re: Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors


quote:

that you haven't a clue what you're talking about.
You mean aside from financially sponsoring disadvantaged kids attending private or parochial school? Aside from seeing those results? Aside from working with teachers to attain those results? Aside from conferring with family members who are/were career teachers? Aside from the common sense that competent choice tops mindless dictate? Trust me, I have a clue. Maybe even a little more than a clue.

So where do you gain your "expertise"?

quote:

you have provided NO evidence that private schools are "better" than public schools
The evidence is in the choices people make. Period.
A situation in which choice is denied speaks for itself.






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MrCarton
UNO Fan
Paradise Valley, MT
Member since Dec 2009
2224 posts

re: Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors


quote:

A situation in which choice is denied speaks for itself.


Bravo good Sir!






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I B Freeman
Member since Oct 2009
5456 posts

re: Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors


quote:

The quality of parenting. How does vouchers fix poor parenting that does not value education?


We are not trying to fix that. We are saying parents who want a choice of a school that caters to poor quality parents and one that doesn't should be given that choice.

THe schools should have the freedom to operate properly too. With vouchers, over time, schools will arise to fill every need better than we do today.






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Wolfhound45
LSU Fan
Member since Nov 2009
15110 posts
 Online 

re: Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors


quote:

A situation in which choice is denied speaks for itself.


Like vouchers?
Like open shops?
Like telling someone they are not truly a minority if they do not vote along party lines?

Seems like someone fears choice.

Now which party would that be?






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I B Freeman
Member since Oct 2009
5456 posts

re: Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors


Back to the OP--there are many conservatives who feel Jindal has failed them and rightfully so. He is a resume polisher and under the microscope of the national press he will melt.

If he were traveling Louisiana making the case for expanded vouchers, tax reform and smaller government he would be much more credible and popular.

His poll numbers have fallen not because he lost democrat support--he never had it. He has lost conservative support. Oh one other thing--it didn't help him any to treat the Ron Paul republicans the way he did during the state convention.






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Taxing Authority
LSU Fan
Houston
Member since Feb 2010
22423 posts

re: Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors


quote:

He trimmed a lot of fat
No wonder Mary is worried.






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cssamerican
New Orleans Saints Fan
Member since Mar 2011
2246 posts

re: Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors


The concept of vouchers is great, the execution in Louisiana is pathetic.

Private schools should be required to have their students take the state test. This way we can know how well students are learning at these schools. This would also give parents proper information in making the best choice for their kid's education. If tax payer is going to fund them both then they should be judged by the same standard.

The money should follow the student. In the current system the money goes wherever the student is on October 1st irregardless where they attend school the rest of the year. So, you can give them money to a school on October first and the kid leaves willing or unwillingly and the kids new school has to take them with no additional funding. That is stupid on an epic level.

There needs to be a way to handle troubled kids that doesn't involve forcing them in the local public or private school with kids who want to learn, such as a separate system geared to teach these kids how to do some trade as way to keep them from being in prison latter in life. Where the focus isn't LEAP scores but rather forming some skill that doesn't necessarily require a lot of book knowledge.




It will be interesting to see if Jindall still has enough stroke to remove income tax and switch to a consumption tax. If he does that is what his legacy will be judged on more than anything else. That would be a massive change not only for everyday residents, it would be a massive change on how business look at the state as well. This would have the biggest and longest impact on the state in the long run.






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mikelowery1911
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Nov 2009
707 posts

re: Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors


quote:

Exactly.
Vouchers are not a way out for all. But they are a way out for some. Those who chose to use vouchers would likely self-select for success. Perhaps for no reason other than not viewing school as "simply a government-funded daycare from age 4-17."


I agree with some of your premise but you are missing the big picture. Vouchers parents do self select the same way as private/charter school who undergo a lengthy application process self select.
But how does this help the students that are left behind?

The voucher solution is a continuation of the main problem with Louisiana public schools. In most school districts in the state the majority of the stronger households(black and white) have left the public school system.

10-20% of the students in failing public schools are the problem. They have no desire to obtain an education and will actively prevent others from learning. 90% of a school's time and resources are spent on these students

60-70% of students in poor performing schools are like most of us and are greatly influenced the environment around them. They will follow the dominant culture of the school. 9% of a school's resources are spent on these students

10-20% of students are self motivated and come strong households that stress the value of education. 1% of a school's time and resources are spent on these students.

The right thing to do would be to get rid of the first group of students in failing schools and refocus the resources on student's who value education and those who can be taught to value education(the majority)






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mikelowery1911
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Nov 2009
707 posts

re: Poll: Jindal Among Nation's Most Unpopular Governors


quote:

We are not trying to fix that. We are saying parents who want a choice of a school that caters to poor quality parents and one that doesn't should be given that choice.



But in doing that you are creating a larger problem by dooming the public schools to become even more a dumping ground for the dysfunctional. I do not care about the public schools I care about the savable children are stuck in these schools because their parents do not care or are unaware of how to play the education game.






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