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TrueTiger 
LSU Fan
Republic of West Florida
Member since Sep 2004
2615 posts
 Online
| re: The Judge: Immigration is a Natural Right (Posted on 1/31/13 at 5:47 pm to CITWTT)
quote:
It is still limited by the laws of the land the emigre intends to choose as his new home.
And here's the catch. I think it is a natural right, but the reality is that nations around the world are not going to respect your right and will even infringe upon it.
So, if you are big and bad enough to overcome the will of a nation that is contrary to your natural right, then you will get to exercise it.
Otherwise your choice is to gripe about it on TD.
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MrCarton 
Alabama Fan
Nashville
Member since Dec 2009
1643 posts
| re: The Judge: Immigration is a Natural Right (Posted on 1/31/13 at 6:03 pm to TrueTiger)
quote:
So, if you are big and bad enough to overcome the will of a nation that is contrary to your natural right, then you will get to exercise it
Well...that pretty much sums up my faith in "natural rights".
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DawgfaninCa 
Georgia Fan
San Francisco, California
Member since Sep 2012
1586 posts
| re: The Judge: Immigration is a Natural Right (Posted on 1/31/13 at 7:40 pm to joshnorris14)
quote:
You can't really be a fan of liberty without being an Anarchist
Under anarchy there is no liberty but I can't expect someone who is a Florida fan to understand that.
This post was edited on 1/31 at 7:42 pm
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joshnorris14 
Florida Fan
Florida
Member since Jan 2009
19554 posts
| re: The Judge: Immigration is a Natural Right (Posted on 1/31/13 at 7:53 pm to olgoi khorkhoi)
quote:
you never answered the question. How did you obtain your "property"?
It's irrelevant to the question. I was answering a hypothetical. Also, the bank isn't the owner of the home, but the owner of the mortgage.
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catholictigerfan
LSU Fan
Member since Oct 2009
26566 posts
Online
| re: The Judge: Immigration is a Natural Right (Posted on 1/31/13 at 8:23 pm to Fat Bastard)
You didn't make the illegal part clear Sry bout that fat
Do you think we should make legal immigration more available?
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catholictigerfan
LSU Fan
Member since Oct 2009
26566 posts
Online
| re: The Judge: Immigration is a Natural Right (Posted on 1/31/13 at 8:25 pm to DawgfaninCa)
Depends on what you mean as freedom
Freedom to do whatever the hell you want yeah anarchy gives you that
Freedom to make a living protect yourself have an impact on society freedom to live in peace for you life anarchy don't ice you that
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joshnorris14
Florida Fan
Florida
Member since Jan 2009
19554 posts
| re: The Judge: Immigration is a Natural Right (Posted on 1/31/13 at 8:27 pm to catholictigerfan)
quote:
Freedom to do whatever the hell you want yeah anarchy gives you that
Freedom to make a living protect yourself have an impact on society freedom to live in peace for you life anarchy don't ice you that
My head is just spinning.
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catholictigerfan
LSU Fan
Member since Oct 2009
26566 posts
Online
| re: The Judge: Immigration is a Natural Right (Posted on 1/31/13 at 8:34 pm to joshnorris14)
Let me make it clearer set about that
When you say freedom
Do you mean freedom to do anything you want
Or do you mean the freedom to be able to do something
For example in an anarchy you have freedom to do whatever you want
But you don't have the freedom to let's say play the piano.
Would you have the freedom o get a quality education in an anarchy or would the conditions of the society make it impossible not making you free to get a quality eduction
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joshnorris14
Florida Fan
Florida
Member since Jan 2009
19554 posts
| re: The Judge: Immigration is a Natural Right (Posted on 1/31/13 at 8:37 pm to catholictigerfan)
I mean you have the freedom to do whatever you want as long as you don't violate the NAP/other people's rights.
quote:
But you don't have the freedom to let's say play the piano.
quote:
Would you have the freedom o get a quality education in an anarchy
Sure
quote:
would the conditions of the society make it impossible not making you free to get a quality eduction
The conditions of the state make it so that you cannot get a quality education now.
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Bestbank Tiger 
Tulane Fan
Landmass Gulf Coast
Member since Jan 2005
15763 posts
Online
| re: The Judge: Immigration is a Natural Right (Posted on 1/31/13 at 8:39 pm to joshnorris14)
quote:
I mean you have the freedom to do whatever you want as long as you don't violate the NAP/other people's rights.
Under anarchy, you have no recourse against those who do violate the NAP. You could carry out vigilante justice, but then there is no due process or rule of law.
quote:
The conditions of the state make it so that you cannot get a quality education now.
Not true. If the public schools suck, you can home school your kids or pay to send them to private school.
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joshnorris14
Florida Fan
Florida
Member since Jan 2009
19554 posts
| re: The Judge: Immigration is a Natural Right (Posted on 1/31/13 at 8:42 pm to Bestbank Tiger)
quote:
Not true. If the public schools suck, you can home school your kids or pay to send them to private school.
That follow a ridiculous state-based curriculum.
quote:
Under anarchy, you have no recourse against those who do violate the NAP. You could carry out vigilante justice, but then there is no due process or rule of law.
Nonsense.
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Bestbank Tiger
Tulane Fan
Landmass Gulf Coast
Member since Jan 2005
15763 posts
Online
| re: The Judge: Immigration is a Natural Right (Posted on 1/31/13 at 8:55 pm to joshnorris14)
quote:
That follow a ridiculous state-based curriculum.
There are certain requirements and I won't defend all of them, but you can supplement that with whatever you wish.
quote:
Nonsense
So what do you suggest the recourse is for the family of a murder victim? And how, if everyone makes up their own laws and their own judicial procedures, do you protect innocent people who are accused of violating the NAP?
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joshnorris14
Florida Fan
Florida
Member since Jan 2009
19554 posts
| re: The Judge: Immigration is a Natural Right (Posted on 1/31/13 at 8:58 pm to Bestbank Tiger)
quote:
So what do you suggest the recourse is for the family of a murder victim? And how, if everyone makes up their own laws and their own judicial procedures, do you protect innocent people who are accused of violating the NAP?
I'm a little tied up right now, but if you're interested I can give you a link to an article or video describing how this could work.
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catholictigerfan
LSU Fan
Member since Oct 2009
26566 posts
Online
| re: The Judge: Immigration is a Natural Right (Posted on 1/31/13 at 8:59 pm to joshnorris14)
quote:
I mean you have the freedom to do whatever you want as long as you don't violate the NAP/other people's rights.
how would you go about enforcing this.
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joshnorris14
Florida Fan
Florida
Member since Jan 2009
19554 posts
| re: The Judge: Immigration is a Natural Right (Posted on 1/31/13 at 9:03 pm to catholictigerfan)
LINK
This is a good example. Tom Woods is a Catholic Anarchist too, you might like him.
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Bestbank Tiger
Tulane Fan
Landmass Gulf Coast
Member since Jan 2005
15763 posts
Online
| re: The Judge: Immigration is a Natural Right (Posted on 1/31/13 at 9:03 pm to joshnorris14)
quote:
I'm a little tied up right now, but if you're interested I can give you a link to an article or video describing how this could work.
Sounds good. I'd be interested in seeing how that could work, and I'm willing to listen to an argument that it would be possible.
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joshnorris14
Florida Fan
Florida
Member since Jan 2009
19554 posts
| re: The Judge: Immigration is a Natural Right (Posted on 1/31/13 at 9:04 pm to Bestbank Tiger)
I posted a link in the post above.
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olgoi khorkhoi
Bucknell Fan
priapism survivor
Member since May 2011
1918 posts
| re: The Judge: Immigration is a Natural Right (Posted on 2/1/13 at 1:10 am to joshnorris14)
it is relevant. you sleep somewhere. wherever that is, it was taken by force and protected by threat of force while it changed hands, right down until the time you came to be there. Who took it and protected it for you? The government. So when you tuck yourself into your bed tonight, where you sleep soundly without fear of violence against you, mutter under your breath a little thank you to those who were willing to do things that go against your noble principles in order for you to have a warm dry place to spout your nonsense.
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Poodlebrain
LSU Fan
Way Right of Rex
Member since Jan 2004
12697 posts
| re: The Judge: Immigration is a Natural Right (Posted on 2/1/13 at 7:21 am to olgoi khorkhoi)
He sleeps with one eye open (sorry no cheesy Metallica reference here). He doesn't need anyone watching his back.
The entire notion of rights and respect for the rights of others would not exist, but for governments through the ages that allowed for specialization of labor. Man didn't have time to delve into philosophy when hunting, gathering and finding shelter were the primary tasks of the day. Anarchy makes no sense as societies can not evolve past the need for limitations on individual acts that are universally accepted and enforced. How does an anarchist society enforce so-called universal values when individuals violate them?
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DawgfaninCa
Georgia Fan
San Francisco, California
Member since Sep 2012
1586 posts
| re: The Judge: Immigration is a Natural Right (Posted on 2/1/13 at 2:15 pm to catholictigerfan)
quote:
Freedom to do whatever the hell you want yeah anarchy gives you that
Anarchy doesn't even give you that freedom because there will always be someone stronger with bigger weapons than you who doesn't want you to have that freedom so they will impose their will on you by force.
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