What do the 'poor', owe society? - Page 2 - TigerDroppings.com

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Cold Pizza
Ohio State Fan
Member since Sep 2011
7639 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

So we can end all individual welfare at the same time we end all corporate welfare? I'm fricking in if you say yes.






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mograyback
Missouri Fan
Member since Jul 2011
7102 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:


wrong again, although most farm subsidies apparently go to the largest farms


Wrong again? Where was the first error?

That is what I'm talking about, it goes to the largest entities within a subsection. So it goes to the largest farms, the largest energy providers, and so on. The biggest chunks don't go to the little guys.







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90proofprofessional
LSU Fan
Member since Mar 2004
8592 posts
 Online 

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

Pal, I'm just going off of the numerous links you could find with a simple google search.

Traditional social programs get between 50-60 billion

you said "social welfare programs"

so nothing now, only a mention of "numerous links" off "google searches"?

Here: according to CBO Medicaid spending ALONE was $275 bil in 2011.






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reverendotis
LSU Fan
Rick's shitty thread expert
Member since Nov 2007
1287 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

fact that we pay more in corporate welfare than social welfare programs



compared with


quote:

Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security—along with other entitlements such as food stamps, unemployment, and housing assistance— make up 62 percent of all federal spending



Social welfare spending is 62% of federal expenditure in FY2012.

You assert that corporate welfare is more than this so it must be at least 62%. So 62% plus 62% already has us at 124% which of course is greater than 100% which is completely ridiculous.






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mograyback
Missouri Fan
Member since Jul 2011
7102 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

so nothing now, only a mention of "numerous links" off "google searches"?


Except for the actual link I posted on the first page.. But here is another one just in case. LINK /

And I was ready for the medicaid argument, surprised you didn't tack on SS too. This link should help clear it up for you..

LINK

With these other aspects of corporate welfare, it totally blows what we spend on all social welfare (including medicaid-medicare) out of the water.





This post was edited on 11/25 at 8:17 am


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mograyback
Missouri Fan
Member since Jul 2011
7102 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

reverendotis


You don't understand many aspects of finance.

I refer you to the post above this one.



This post was edited on 11/25 at 8:24 am


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baybeefeetz
the now
Member since Sep 2009
13543 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


op i think it's a great question. starts with good citizenship, i think.





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CollegeFBRules
LSU Fan
Member since Oct 2008
19626 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


You linked a blog with this author:

quote:

John Atcheson is author of the novel, A Being Darkly Wise, an eco-thriller and Book One of a Trilogy centered on global warming. His writing has appeared in The New York Times, the Washington Post, the Baltimore Sun, the San Jose Mercury News and other major newspapers. Atcheson’s book reviews are featured on Climateprogess.org.


If you're going to use $9 trillion in government loans to corporations, then we need to discuss Fannie and Freddie outlays on mortgages. How much of the $11 trillion in mortgage outlays are backed by the federal government?

I'm not arguing BS lending practices, but our sources are biased and you're arguing only one side of a two-sided problem. But so are many others in this thread, just from a different angle. So again, not picking on you.



This post was edited on 11/25 at 8:29 am


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cssamerican
New Orleans Saints Fan
Member since Mar 2011
2232 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


All the corporate welfare should be eliminated tomorrow. I don't think you will find a lot of people arguing against this.

The problem with social programs is I am driving a old car with 190,000 miles on it and paying the daycare $1,200.00 a month for my two kids. Yet, the woman in front of me is driving a Lexus and uses her thumb to validate her child care assistance money from the Federal Government. Very few people would have a problem with social programs if they went to hard working people who tried their best but just fell on hard times, but in MOST cases they are going to people who are gaming the system! And that pisses people off who pay taxes and have to pay their way while watching others play them.

The reason the Red states are the biggest takers, yet vote Republican is because it is the tax payers in those states that see the abuse first hand and are disgusted by it.



This post was edited on 11/25 at 8:37 am


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RCDfan1950
LSU Fan
United States
Member since Feb 2007
10528 posts
 Online 

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

In your view of the do you ever consider the billions of dollars in subsidies given annually to corporations? (This doesn't even count tax breaks and write offs) Is the fact that we pay more in corporate welfare than social welfare programs figure into your opinion? LINK Do you ever ponder the difference between a businessman writing off his fancy dinner as a 'corporate expense' while complaining about those lazy poor people using food stamps?


My point has nothing to do with the 'rich', Mo; we know the line re them. What I am asking is directed toward those who contribute NOTHING to society...yet, especially as of late, assume an entitlement psychology as if they are owed by productive citizens...yet owe NOTHING themselves.

Do you raise your own children with such a mindset? One child helps with the housechores, another rejects that burden...yet you reward both equally? You instill NO civic responsibility whatsoever? No rules according to real justice?

Who is ultimately more harmed by such? Those rich who take the deduction...or the poor who become spiritually corrupt, as as such, even more of a burden on those who support them. And at some point, due to what becomes an obvious moral fault...they lose any sympathy toward their plight at the bottom from the producers. What then...a tyrannical mob rule *democracy* from demogogic *leaders* who manipulate emotions and human envy for the sake of power. Or mis-guided ideology which justifies such political insanity.

I would love to see you address the OP. What do they owe? What do your children owe your family group? Anything?







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mograyback
Missouri Fan
Member since Jul 2011
7102 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

op i think it's a great question. starts with good citizenship, i think.


What starts with good citizenship? The poor paying back society? Because that's what the op asked.

So are you saying the poor aren't as good of citizens as the wealthy? I think we know for sure that the wealthy is full of bad citizens as well.






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mograyback
Missouri Fan
Member since Jul 2011
7102 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

RCDfan1950


You are on another planet, sorry man.







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mograyback
Missouri Fan
Member since Jul 2011
7102 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

Those rich who take the deduction


Do you know what a subsidy is?






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badlands
Florida Fan
Member since Apr 2008
1189 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

Do you ever ponder the difference between a businessman writing off his fancy dinner as a 'corporate expense' while complaining about those lazy poor people using food stamps?



Is this the best you got? Corporate expense is paid for by the company. Welfare is paid for via taxes and is an expense on the ones who do not benefit from it. The guy you are taking about in this case is perhaps in the process of establishing a business relationship from which several will profit. In this case he is instructed to spare no expense and get the deal made, hence money will flow. That dinner is an investment not only for the company but for the government as well when regarding the taxes that may surface from the transaction between the involved parties. Welfare and food stamps offer what outside of the people using them?



This post was edited on 11/25 at 8:41 am


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RCDfan1950
LSU Fan
United States
Member since Feb 2007
10528 posts
 Online 

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

You are on another planet, sorry man.


What does my being 'on another planet' have to do with the question? Other than using that as a DODGE...to avert a cogent argument.

ps...I worked damn hard to get to that 'other planet'...and with the help of the Good Lord...now savor my visionary reward. Don't feel "sorry" for me buddy...save it for those 'poor', or them that are set up for the fall. Not that pity is worth jack squat anyway. Truth rules.







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mograyback
Missouri Fan
Member since Jul 2011
7102 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:


Is this the best you got? Corporate expense is paid for by the company. The guy you are taking about in this case is perhaps in the process of establishing a business relationship from which several will profit. In this case he is instructed to spare no expense and get the deal made, hence money will flow. That dinner is an investment not only for the company but for the government as well when regarding the taxes that may surface from the transaction between the involved parties. Welfare and food stamps offer what outside of the people using them?


Is that the best I got? Actually no, which is why what you quoted is only part of what was said in that post. I believe 100 billion in corporate subsidies was also mentioned.

And your premise is just awful. My dad went deep sea fishing off the coast of Vancouver this summer for work, this event was written off (we got in an argument about it). The same men could have done business together without going on a deep sea fishing adventure.

The ultimate hypocrisy is a businessman writing off a bottle of wine while complaining about lazy blacks getting food stamps. The stance that the expensive dinner will get a profit is a built in aspect to the self absorbed reality many people live in.

quote:

Welfare and food stamps offer what outside of the people using them?


What?

Have you ever heard of Solyndra? Who did the BILLIONS given to them help outside of, well no one. The company is now bankrupt.



This post was edited on 11/25 at 8:49 am


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mograyback
Missouri Fan
Member since Jul 2011
7102 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

RCDfan1950



I said you are on another planet because you don't know what a subsidy is (hurry up and google it, then come back and act like you knew in the first place).






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lsusaintsfan4life
LSU Fan
Member since Mar 2008
840 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


You are way off base here and likely arguing just because you enjoy the fun of it. I am all for systems that encourage good behavior such as "corporate welfare" that incentivizes business growth and job creation.

As many posters above have demonstrated we have a society of takers. It needs to stop. Your arguments would hold more value if you would address those that "game" the system instead of being parasitic.






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badlands
Florida Fan
Member since Apr 2008
1189 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

The same men could have done business together without going on a deep sea fishing adventure.


And the guy getting food stamps can in most cases can feed himself by other means too? I guess the guys on the fishing trip should avoid all sorts of enjoyment while at work so that they can pay a greater amount in taxes?

As for the other point. The business dinner and its outcome offers a benefit to society. While I know some people need assistance in the form of welfare and food stamps, many abuse the system and they offer nothing to society in the process.






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badlands
Florida Fan
Member since Apr 2008
1189 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

The stance that the expensive dinner will get a profit is a built in aspect to the self absorbed reality many people live in.



If you want to see self absorbed watch people in the checkout line spending your tax contributions.



This post was edited on 11/25 at 8:51 am


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