When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist? | Page 4 | TigerDroppings.com

Posted byMessage
Champagne
New Orleans Saints Fan
French and Spanish Empire Border
Member since Oct 2007
11731 posts

re: When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist?


quote:

Marx argued for the communal ownership of the means of production. "Redistribution of wealth" isn't Marxism, it's socialism, and while the two are related they're not the same thing.


Well, I should probably use the term "Squishy Marxism" or something like that to indicate that we are not talking about "strict construction" adherence to Karl Marx's writings.

Yes, I agree that they are related, but, not identical.

The clear point that I'd like to make is this: these related collectivist/redistributionist policies that Obama's Dems embrace are related to Marxist ideas AND are totally alien to the principles upon which the Founders and Framers created the USA.

Obama and his supporters embrace policies of governance that are alien to what the Founders and Framers intended.



This post was edited on 11/15 at 1:07 pm


Back to top
Bayou Sam
LSU Fan
Snake and Jake's Christmas Club
Member since Aug 2009
4995 posts

re: When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist?


quote:

According to the criteria I've read so far, what 20th or 21st century President was not a Marxist?


"How dare you?", objected the 19th century. "Lincoln--Marxist. Henry Clay--Marxist. The national bank--Marxist. Hell, we had the Louisiana Purchase! The Constitution? The government can regulate commerce? We are founded as a Marxist country! We were Marxists avant la lettre"






Back to top
Champagne
New Orleans Saints Fan
French and Spanish Empire Border
Member since Oct 2007
11731 posts

re: When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist?


quote:

I choose to call Obama a Communist. But if you'd like to call him a Marxist or a Socialist that's fine with me. He believes in the subjugation of the individual to the collective. He believes in a totalitarian state unfettered by the restrictions of the Constitution.


I agree with this as the correct view.






Back to top
darkhorse
Member since Aug 2012
7362 posts

re: When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist?


quote:

"How dare you?", objected the 19th century. "Lincoln--Marxist. Henry Clay--Marxist. The national bank--Marxist. Hell, we had the Louisiana Purchase! The Constitution? The government can regulate commerce? We are founded as a Marxist country! We were Marxists avant la lettre"




Good lord!!!! Now I completely understand why this country is the way it is now!






Back to top
crawdaddy52
Vanderbilt Fan
Member since Dec 2010
855 posts

re: When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist?


Bayou, I thought I'd start at about the time Federal Income tax was initiated but couldn't exclude TR's Marxist trust busting - left out his Marxist national parks.


This post was edited on 11/15 at 1:22 pm


Back to top
darkhorse
Member since Aug 2012
7362 posts

re: When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist?


Again.. Obama had to run in this election as something he is not to avoid waking up the rest of the country.


1- He ran on cutting corp taxes.... agreed with Romney even. Now he is raising them.

2- In stead of 1%, he's now at 2%

3- Oh no.. we gonna drill baby!!! not... how many acres did he just pull 1.5 million??


Fact... His style of government does not work! I have asked over and over and over for an example from people here and ZERO!!!! there are none!

"Welllll.... it's sorta new!!" BS! It's been tried throughout history and it fails!

I will say again, you point out the Swedes! The swedes are running as fast as they can from what you state is the MODEL for what you want in the US.







Back to top
crawdaddy52
Vanderbilt Fan
Member since Dec 2010
855 posts

re: When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist?


Darkhorse, I think Bayou was exaggeration purposely. I would say "good lord" to Nixon and Ford trying to impose wag and price controls as about as Marxist as you can get. No?





Back to top
  Replies (0)
DCRebel
Georgetown Fan
An office somewhere
Member since Aug 2009
17576 posts

re: When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist?


quote:

Or you just believe that the state should be subjugated to individuals rights.



Eh, chicken vs. the egg. I think both can be the case.






Back to top
  Replies (0)
Bayou Sam
LSU Fan
Snake and Jake's Christmas Club
Member since Aug 2009
4995 posts

re: When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist?


quote:

He ran on cutting corp taxes.... agreed with Romney even. Now he is raising them.


You keep repeating this, but I haven't seen anything by Obama or his staff indicating this to be the case. Unless you mean that effective corp tax would go up because of cuts to deductions.






Back to top
ScoopAndScore
baton rouge
Member since Oct 2008
7769 posts

re: When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist?


quote:

Marx did not invent the idea that the rich exploited the poor

Perhaps the smart people exploit the stupid people. And then in some cases get rich doing so. Is that the smart person's fault?
Guys with much better basketball ability exploited my lesser abilities, and turned that into a scholarship and maybe even more riches. Is that the more gifted athlete's fault? Is it anyone's fault?
This fairness BS is the craziest shite ever.






Back to top
DCRebel
Georgetown Fan
An office somewhere
Member since Aug 2009
17576 posts

re: When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist?


quote:

So, what are you?


A social liberal and a fiscal centrist. I believe government to be necessary to preserve order and protect individual rights, and I feel it can serve functions beyond that if operated properly.

quote:

You just defined moral equivalence and don't even realize it. How sad.



Please elaborate.

quote:

But since you don't understand M.E.,


Oh that's it. I don't at all understand macroeconomics. You, on the other hand, you totally get it.

quote:

BO's raising taxes = RR's lowering taxes because both Presidents changed tax rates.


Both are Keynesian practices. You don't honestly believe that Reagan is somehow less Keynesian than Obama, do you?

In terms of their opinions of the role of government in controlling the economy, RR = BO. They differ in HOW, but not in WHY, capiche?

quote:

So, you want a link that says "Obama found to be a Marxist".



Yes. Or just anything that would prove the claim that he's a Marxist.






Back to top
DCRebel
Georgetown Fan
An office somewhere
Member since Aug 2009
17576 posts

re: When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist?


quote:

AND are totally alien to the principles upon which the Founders and Framers created the USA.


I'm not so sure that any of us can be so sure about that statement.






Back to top
Eurocat
Northwestern Fan
Member since Apr 2004
5114 posts

re: When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist?


Y'all keep throwing around the term "Marxist" like it was some sort of BAD thing.







Back to top
  Replies (0)
MrTide33
Alabama Fan
Southeastern Central North America
Member since Nov 2012
3096 posts

re: When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist?


quote:

You're attempting to draw a very poor analogy


Great. Tear it apart. Criticize it. I don't mind. But don't just sit there and tell me it's poor and not explain. Rip it to shreds






Back to top
  Replies (0)
Zach
LSU Fan
Member since May 2005
64407 posts

re: When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist?


quote:

A social liberal and a fiscal centrist. I believe government to be necessary to preserve order and protect individual rights, and I feel it can serve functions beyond that if operated properly.

1. What is a fiscal centrist?
2. What are the individual rights that govt needs to protect?
3. What functions beyond that should it operate properly?

quote:

Oh that's it. I don't at all understand macroeconomics. You, on the other hand, you totally get it.


Moral Equivalence ...Try to pay attention.

quote:

Both are Keynesian practices. You don't honestly believe that Reagan is somehow less Keynesian than Obama, do you?


Dumbest post of the week. There was NOTHING about RR tax decreases that were Keynesian. Another example of M.E. Obama = Reagan. Yep, that's the ticket.

quote:

Yes. Or just anything that would prove the claim that he's a Marxist.


Already proved that. His life.






Back to top
crawdaddy52
Vanderbilt Fan
Member since Dec 2010
855 posts

re: When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist?


I repeat, has Obama done or proposed anything close to something as Marxist-like as a central authority trying to tell someone what they can charge for their product or service or telling someone what they can receive for their labor? Thats what Nixon and Jerry Ford tried to do. So they must be Marxist - cause Obama hasn't done or proposed anything this extreme.


This post was edited on 11/15 at 2:09 pm


Back to top
darkhorse
Member since Aug 2012
7362 posts

re: When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist?


quote:

You keep repeating this, but I haven't seen anything by Obama or his staff indicating this to be the case. Unless you mean that effective corp tax would go up because of cuts to deductions.


Not eliminating deductions.. the wording is NEW taxes!

And I keep tell you Carney stated it too.. so Link for you.

LINK


quote:

White House press secretary Jay Carney said the president would bring to the table a proposal for $1.6 trillion in new taxes on business and the wealthy


Not sure what else you are asking for. Every news agency has reported that..



This post was edited on 11/15 at 2:14 pm


Back to top
PaddlingTiger
LSU Fan
St. Louis, MO
Member since Jun 2010
1066 posts

re: When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist?


quote:

I have asked over and over and over for an example from people here and ZERO!!!! there are none!


Worked just fine under Bill Clinton. Sorry, but arguing over whether to increase the top marginal tax rates by a few points is not Marxism. It is just two sides of the same coin of capitalism.






Back to top
darkhorse
Member since Aug 2012
7362 posts

re: When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist?


quote:

quote:
I have asked over and over and over for an example from people here and ZERO!!!! there are none!


Worked just fine under Bill Clinton. Sorry, but arguing over whether to increase the top marginal tax rates by a few points is not Marxism. It is just two sides of the same coin of capitalism.



LOL!!!! We didn't have the ACA.. so no, we were not a socialist nation






Back to top
Bayou Sam
LSU Fan
Snake and Jake's Christmas Club
Member since Aug 2009
4995 posts

re: When are more people going to start accepting Obama is a Marxist?


quote:

Perhaps the smart people exploit the stupid people. And then in some cases get rich doing so. Is that the smart person's fault?


Perhaps the "stupid" people wise up, and get together to pass a law preventing their exploitation. Is that the "stupid" people's fault?






Back to top


Back to top