Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits - Page 14 - TigerDroppings.com

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JohnnyKilroy
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Member since Oct 2012
7526 posts

re: Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits


quote:

Is the government illegally seizing my property when they "force" me to provide my financial data to qualify for food stamps?


No.

What do you think tax filings are?






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JohnnyKilroy
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Member since Oct 2012
7526 posts

re: Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits


quote:

It can absolutely pay for itself if done correctly.



A lot of what government does can fit into this category. It never quite works out that way. I'd rather not give them another chance to frick it up.






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haggard79
LSU Fan
Member since Jan 2008
503 posts

re: Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits


How is taking a drug test fee out of a welfare check, the governments money (My Money), searching and seizing from another person. Its NOT the recepients money, they are willingly accepting charity, they are not forced to accept this money.





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BTHog
Arkansas Fan
Member since Jul 2012
8335 posts

re: Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits


quote:

Unconstitutional. Illegal search and seizure without probable cause. It's also why I oppose TSA searches and pat downs. Boarding a plane is not probable cause for a search.

/thread



When you CONSENT to a search aka you get in line to board a flight knowing the search WILL happen, the search needs no probable cause .

Same with this, if you accept welfare KNOWING that drug tests are mandatory, the 4th doesn't apply.

consent nullifies the need for probable cause. That's why cops can ask you if you mind if they search your vehicle even during the most routine of traffic stops, if you give permission, you can't later claim they violated your rights.

DUH!!






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Baloo
LSU Fan
Formerly MDGeaux
Member since Sep 2003
43059 posts

re: Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits


quote:

So government jobs that require drug testing do this illegally?

I think it is, unless there is an issue of public safety, at which point the public's right to safety is more compelling than the person's individual liberty.

But the way we voluntarily destroy the Fourth Amendment any time someone mentions "drugs" pisses me off. It's a terrible precedent and it's just wrong. I wish more people who claimed to love liberty so much took a greater interest in the Fourth Amendment, which has been slowly gutted over the course of the drug war.






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bradybones24
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Oct 2012
255 posts

re: Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits


quote:

A lot of what government does can fit into this category. It never quite works out that way. I'd rather not give them another chance to frick it up.


I agree and I said it in that posts...they won't do it because they're afraid to piss them off. However, the argument was is it the right thing to do if it can pay for itself?






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FT
Georgia Tech Fan
The University of LSU Fan
Member since Oct 2003
10798 posts

re: Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits


At what point in boarding a flight do you give your consent for a search? The act of boarding or attempting to board is not consent.

Look, I don't want any of my tax dollars paying for someone else to get high. I want them paying for me to get high. But I won't sacrifice civil liberties to prevent it.






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BTHog
Arkansas Fan
Member since Jul 2012
8335 posts

re: Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits


quote:

How is taking a drug test fee out of a welfare check, the governments money (My Money), searching and seizing from another person. Its NOT the recepients money, they are willingly accepting charity, they are not forced to accept this money.


Taking the fee out of their food stamps isn't right. 90% of food stamp users do not use drugs, why should they have lesser benefits for testing?


Now perhaps making someone pay out of their pocket if they fail and need a second test to get back on the dole would be fair.








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JohnnyKilroy
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Member since Oct 2012
7526 posts

re: Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits


quote:

But the way we voluntarily destroy the Fourth Amendment any time someone mentions "drugs" pisses me off. It's a terrible precedent and it's just wrong. I wish more people who claimed to love liberty so much took a greater interest in the Fourth Amendment, which has been slowly gutted over the course of the drug war.



.






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BTHog
Arkansas Fan
Member since Jul 2012
8335 posts

re: Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits


quote:

At what point in boarding a flight do you give your consent for a search? The act of boarding or attempting to board is not consent.


At the point where you purchased your ticket on which the fact that you will be searched prior to boarding is printed , creating a contract which YOU consent to.

You know , I'm really getting tired of a conversation about politics where people are either stupid, or dishonest.

If you don't like the TSA fine, make an argument which doesn't include something as stupid as "I didn't consent to a search" because even a fricking child can see that yes you DID consent when you walked into the airport.







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bradybones24
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Oct 2012
255 posts

re: Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits


No issues with the fourth amendment...but nobody's coming into my home looking for drugs...and the same would be true for someone getting a drug test to receive a "privilege". Welfare is NOT a right. They do not have to accept the money. Nor did they earn it by being born.





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FT
Georgia Tech Fan
The University of LSU Fan
Member since Oct 2003
10798 posts

re: Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits


I don't think people understand probable cause and consent. I also think it's bull shite that you can be charged with a DWI for NOT blowing.

My mom was killed by a drunk driver. I don't want anyone driving drunk, but how is refusal to consent to a search EVER grounds for charging someone?






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Baloo
LSU Fan
Formerly MDGeaux
Member since Sep 2003
43059 posts

re: Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits


quote:

When you CONSENT to a search aka you get in line to board a flight knowing the search WILL happen, the search needs no probable cause .

but it's not a consent search. Try and board a plane without consenting to a search and see what happens. You are compelled to submit to a search if you wish to board a non-government-controlled aircraft. How does that make any sense?






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JohnnyKilroy
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Member since Oct 2012
7526 posts

re: Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits


quote:

I don't think people understand probable cause and consent.


Yep.






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Baloo
LSU Fan
Formerly MDGeaux
Member since Sep 2003
43059 posts

re: Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits


quote:

At the point where you purchased your ticket on which the fact that you will be searched prior to boarding is printed , creating a contract which YOU consent to.

When I buy a ticket from an airline, I am signing a contract with that airline, not the government. What promise to perform is the government giving as consideration? What offer have I accepted from them? How on earth are they a party to this contract between me and the airline?






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FT
Georgia Tech Fan
The University of LSU Fan
Member since Oct 2003
10798 posts

re: Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits


quote:

but it's not a consent search. Try and board a plane without consenting to a search and see what happens. You are compelled to submit to a search if you wish to board a non-government-controlled aircraft. How does that make any sense?


Exactly. It'd be like a confession that was coerced. Any decent lawyer would get it thrown out in court.

You have no choice but to submit or you can't access something that government should not be the sole arbiter of policing. That's not true consent any more than a coerced confession is a real confession.






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navy
Navy Fan
Bannedeville, SC
Member since Sep 2010
5007 posts

re: Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits


quote:

Should provide jobs in the drug testing industry


quote:

A truly fulfilling pursuit in life.




Can't be any less fulfilling than working at the damn welfare office.






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bradybones24
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Oct 2012
255 posts

re: Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits


quote:

My mom was killed by a drunk driver. I don't want anyone driving drunk, but how is refusal to consent to a search EVER grounds for charging someone?


Its not and I'm sorry about your mother. However, if all you had to do is not blow then nobody would blow...and the amount of drunk drivers on the road would certainly increase.






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RogerTheShrubber
LSU Fan
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
87640 posts

re: Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits


quote:


A lot of what government does can fit into this category. It never quite works out that way. I'd rather not give them another chance to frick it up


Not to mention the desire to have the government drug test people when they have no suspicion of use.

The overreach by so called conservatives is hilarious. And sad.....






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JohnnyKilroy
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Member since Oct 2012
7526 posts

re: Texas to begin drug testing for welfare/unemployment benefits


quote:

The overreach by so called conservatives is hilarious. And sad.....



.






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