Is Abortion Murder? | Page 12 | TigerDroppings.com

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Tigah in the ATL
LSU Fan
Atlanta
Member since Feb 2005
25238 posts

re: Is Abortion Murder?


quote:

this thread may have opened some eyes on the reality of abortion and how the media and governemnt like to make it out as no big deal






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CollegeFBRules
LSU Fan
Member since Oct 2008
19855 posts

re: Is Abortion Murder?


quote:

Tigah in the ATL




In his defense, he did say he was 20 earlier in the thread. He's got a lot to learn.






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Tigah in the ATL
LSU Fan
Atlanta
Member since Feb 2005
25238 posts

re: Is Abortion Murder?


quote:

at 5 weeks or so when brain development starts, frick people who get abortions.
which means basically everyone who gets one.






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Tigah in the ATL
LSU Fan
Atlanta
Member since Feb 2005
25238 posts

re: Is Abortion Murder?


quote:

and side with our founding documents.
that is a bit of a stretch






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jacquespene8
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Sep 2007
2756 posts

re: Is Abortion Murder?


Murder is defined as unlawful and premeditated...the premeditated part is there, no doubt. I guess the unlawful part depends on where you live.

In my opinion? Yes it's murder in all cases. Life being ended by others without consent from the life in question.

I would still be the same old ugly dude whether or not my parents acts were consensual.






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notslim99
LSU Fan
City of Bossier City
Member since Feb 2005
3659 posts

re: Is Abortion Murder?


quote:

that is a bit of a stretch


Ok. I side with the "Inalienable rights" line in the Declaration. If a fetus/zygote/baby is a human, why should it be denied its most basic human right?






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LSUSaintsHornets
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Based Pelican
Member since Feb 2008
6605 posts

re: Is Abortion Murder?


quote:

which means basically everyone who gets one

pretty much.






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MikeTIGER83
LSU Fan
Lake Charles
Member since Feb 2012
379 posts

re: Is Abortion Murder?


YES.

No matter the circumstance. If a woman is raped she is a victim of that most terrible incident but if a baby was conceived and she aborts it, then the baby is a victim of murder. That baby didn't ask to be conceived by rape just like the mother didn't asked to be raped. There are some very distinguishing individuals that were conceived by rape and one that comes to mind is a well known evangelist.

I know most women go into a "hiding" mode where they don't tell people about what happened until later but for the most part if people knew about it sooner they could give that women the day after pill to help with this.

The fact is that the majority of abortions are done by people who've had relations with someone they chose to have them with. Once a baby is conceived they don't feel like they are ready or don't want them at all. As much as it is their choice not to be parents, it is that baby's right to live. There are consequences for having sex, people should know this by now. If they don't want the baby they could give it to the millions of people that cannot conceive.

That's might take and my belief on it FWIW.






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Katy Tiger
LSU Fan
Houston area
Member since Sep 2004
5637 posts

re: Is Abortion Murder?


Abortion is an interesting topic because it forces you to address the issue on three levels - Legal, Moral, and Biological.

When does a fetus legally become viable? Is that really what you want to base your opinion on? Do you let judges and politicians form the basis for many other of your beliefs?

When do you think human life biologically starts? Conception? At some point between conception and birth? If there is no interruption of the gestation process, would this fetus live to birth or not?

And lastly, based on how you answered the previous questions, how do your morally justify your position on abortion when viewed in context of your other beliefs. If you believe murder is wrong, and a fetus would normally result in a healthy baby in our country, what does this mean to you?

The most logically and morally vacant argument of all in support of abortion is the women's right argument. Isn't ironic that the same people that support this argument also support all kinds of other nonsense, like saving bait fish over farm irrigation, or spiking trees to injure lumberjacks, or punishing companies for being profitable. Its a particularly sad kind of twisted Nazi logic that says its okay to kill if it benefits me and I don't have to look at it or think about it.






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Archie Bengal Bunker
Florida State Fan
Member since Jun 2008
15511 posts

re: Is Abortion Murder?


quote:

I disagree with you and side with our founding documents.


Sorry if you already posted this, but can you give some excerpts* from the FF's on abortion?



This post was edited on 11/14 at 10:17 am


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Archie Bengal Bunker
Florida State Fan
Member since Jun 2008
15511 posts

re: Is Abortion Murder?


quote:

notslim99


Is brain death actual death? Or do you believe that as long as the body is autonomously performing biological functions, such as breathing, that a person must be kept alive?



This post was edited on 11/14 at 10:21 am


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notslim99
LSU Fan
City of Bossier City
Member since Feb 2005
3659 posts

re: Is Abortion Murder?


quote:

Sorry if you already posted this, but can you give some excerpts* from the FF's on abortion?


Inalienable rights. One is life.


quote:

Is brain death actual death?


Yes.

quote:

Or do you believe that as long as the body is autonomously performing biological functions, such as breathing, that a person must be kept alive?


Yes. Understanding physiological process is key. When the brain is dead, the body can no longer perform autonomous life-sustaining functions. We can keep them going with machines, but that's not autonomous.

ETA: That's why we have living wills. The person can have their end-of-life choices on paper, so that they will be executed if the person is unable to execute them. When it's your body and yours alone, then you have the choice.



This post was edited on 11/14 at 10:31 am


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MrTide33
Alabama Fan
Southeastern Central North America
Member since Nov 2012
3207 posts

re: Is Abortion Murder?


Here's a good rundown on abortion arguments.

1.) Viability- the youngest premie baby to survive is roughly 20 weeks. However, you must not count survival outside the womb as the benchmark, but whether or not the child was alive. The child dying quickly after birth makes no difference as to whether or not it was a living human being.

2.) Rape, incest, life of mother- These depend on if the unborn child is considered a living human being with rights to life. If so, there is no argument for any of these three. NEWS FLASH. Intentional abortion is never necessary to save a mother's life. A baby may die in an attempt to save the mother but not intentionally.

3.) Woman's right to choose, right to privacy- inapplicable if murder. There is no right to murder, or privacy of murder

4.) When does life begin?- Bodily autonomy begins at conception. Yes, it needs its mother to survive, but it functions on it's own, the mother is an outside source for its development. People act like a fetus is an organ or something before it's viable






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Ace Midnight
LSU Fan
Currently asymptomatic
Member since Dec 2006
33551 posts

re: Is Abortion Murder?


No. Murder is an unlawful killing and, under most circumstances an "abortion" in the United States is a legal medical procedure that destroys an unborn child/fetus, but is one generally protected by the US Supreme Court's decision in Roe v. Wade.

Obviously it is ALWAYS a killing of an unborn person. It is also, if requested by the mother and performed by a licensed doctor, GENERALLY lawful in the United States.

(Just as capital punishment in the US is not murder - it is, by definition a lawful killing - one that is conducted in accordance with law)

Maybe your question (and it is a big one) should be, at what point does the child's right to continue to live override the mother's option to discontinue the arrangement? Answers will range from conception to successful live birth. Reasoning will boggle the imagination.






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JWS3
Purdue Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Jun 2008
2502 posts

re: Is Abortion Murder?


Yes, if I shoot and kill a pregnant woman, I will be charged with the murder of her and her unborn child, whats the difference?





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MrTide33
Alabama Fan
Southeastern Central North America
Member since Nov 2012
3207 posts

re: Is Abortion Murder?


quote:

Murder is an unlawful killing


Earlier in this thread we defined murder as the killing of an innocent human being with the right to life. For our purposes in the thread.

quote:

at what point does the child's right to continue to live override the mother's option to discontinue the arrangement?


At least at the point when you can prove life of a child in the womb. Maybe earlier. But a woman has no right at all to discontinue a child's life






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ShoeBang
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Member since May 2012
4621 posts

re: Is Abortion Murder?


If the fetus is terminated 1 second after conception it is murder IMO. No matter the reason for the conception. Upon conception , you have created human life. Life starts when cells combine and begin to multiply to form a human.

IMO, this country and our society's majority has endorsed and even subsidized the killing of millions upon millions of innocent human beings. Makes Hitler & Stalin look like friggin Mother Theresa.

Prevention of pregnancy is so easy and accessible in this country that abortion should not even be needed. If you can't wrap it up OR swallow a pill OR get a vasectomy OR tie your tubes OR use any of the other birth control methods OR even just pull out, then you shouldn't be having sex.

The major talking point of this issue is "the woman's right to choose". What about the child she created when she let some dude dump a load in her? That child has no voice. I can damn well guarantee if the innocent baby could, it would choose to not be murdered in the womb.











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Ace Midnight
LSU Fan
Currently asymptomatic
Member since Dec 2006
33551 posts

re: Is Abortion Murder?


quote:

Earlier in this thread we defined murder as the killing of an innocent human being with the right to life. For our purposes in the thread.


quote:

At least at the point when you can prove life of a child in the womb. Maybe earlier. But a woman has no right at all to discontinue a child's life


In that case, using that definition of "murder", abortion = murder. I believe life begins at conception, or so nearly in time as to be indistinguishable.

I have completely withdrawn my objection to abortion on demand, despite my deeply-held personal beliefs, because I am willing (reluctantly) to allow the genetic material of women who are willing to destroy their progeny to naturally select itself away. May G-d have mercy on my soul (and those of the little ones who have been/are/will be lost).






This post was edited on 11/14 at 12:05 pm


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MrTide33
Alabama Fan
Southeastern Central North America
Member since Nov 2012
3207 posts

re: Is Abortion Murder?


quote:

I have completely withdrawn my objection to abortion on demand, despite my deeply-held personal beliefs,




Youre giving up on those innocent little children? C'mon man, we need people like you to step up and fight. Not only do they have a right to life, they have the right to an attorney. Who's standing up and fighting for them right now?






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Dupont3
LSU Fan
Keithville
Member since Nov 2011
1382 posts

re: Is Abortion Murder?


Yes, in all circumstances.





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