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Catman88 
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Dec 2004
36377 posts
| re: Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000? (Posted on 10/12/12 at 1:09 pm to lsufan1971)
If all these companies do make less than 250k then doesnt that also mean that Obamacares impact on the middle class is much bigger than what is being stated? If the avg business owner is making 100k then what will he/she be making after they are forced to shell out healthcare or pay a penalty?
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OldSouth
LSU Fan
Folsom, LA
Member since Oct 2011
4294 posts
| re: Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000? (Posted on 10/12/12 at 1:09 pm to lsufan1971)
quote:
Example: Small business makes $1M in profits after expenses. Small business owner pays himself $1M in salary so as to avoid his business having to pay anything in taxes.
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Choctaw 
Navy Fan
Pumpin' Sunshine
Member since Jul 2007
39915 posts
 Online
| re: Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000? (Posted on 10/12/12 at 1:11 pm to Mid Iowa Tiger)
quote:
If I keep what is mine it has not been taken from someone.
liberals believe that if a person becomes wealthy, then another person has to become poor. that the rich live off of making others poor. it's f'n mind blowing.
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Taxing Authority
LSU Fan
Houston
Member since Feb 2010
16738 posts
| re: Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000? (Posted on 10/12/12 at 1:12 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83)
quote:
Sorry if you bought the GOP line about taxing the small businesses and job creators
How does that invalidate who creates the jobs?
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davesdawgs 
Georgia Fan
Georgia
Member since Oct 2008
11005 posts
Online
| re: Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000? (Posted on 10/12/12 at 1:14 pm to Eighteen)
quote:
Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000?
Technically yes through a nebulous definition of small business. However: LINK
"About 78 percent of all companies in America don't actually employ anybody other than their owner." In other words most of the 97% aren't a factor in the employment picture.
Also:
=================================================
For sake of argument though, let's ignore all those solo operators. Instead we'll focus only on the roughly 4.1 million companies that are both affected by individual income tax rates and have actual employees on their payrolls. We can call these "actual small businesses."
Turns out, many of these actual small businesses aren't really what you probably think of as "small." Just 1.3 percent of actual small businesses employ 43 percent of the country's actual business workers. These are companies with 100 people or more Think along the lines of big Washington law and lobbying firms, which are usually organized as partnerships, and can rake in hundreds of millions of dollars a year in revenue.
=================================================
Translation: The term small business is misleading. Most of the job creation in what is called small businesses, is within big companies that make over 250k a year and would be and are being hurt by Obamacare and Obama's tax policies in general.
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USMCTiger03
LSU Fan
Member since Sep 2007
58427 posts
| re: Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000? (Posted on 10/12/12 at 1:16 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83)
quote:
What they mean is wealth redistribution upwards
How can you redistribute something that you never had?
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Taxing Authority
LSU Fan
Houston
Member since Feb 2010
16738 posts
| re: Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000? (Posted on 10/12/12 at 1:16 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83)
quote:
Might want to mention all most are doing is paying themselves a salary since they run the business.
This isn't how a pass-through small business tax works. You can't "pay yourself a salary". What you net = your income.
quote:
Example: Small business makes $1M in profits after expenses. Small business owner pays himself $1M in salary so as to avoid his business having to pay anything in taxes.
You truly are ignorant.
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Taxing Authority
LSU Fan
Houston
Member since Feb 2010
16738 posts
| re: Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000? (Posted on 10/12/12 at 1:18 pm to OldSouth)
quote:
Let me explain this to you genius. I personally own 3 LLC's in my name that have no income what so ever.
I have two that will have $0 in income this year.
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LSURussian
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Feb 2005
63225 posts
| re: Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000? (Posted on 10/12/12 at 1:19 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83)
quote:
Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000?
Yep.
Do you have a link for that or are you just pulling that answer out of your arse like you usually do?
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Tiger n Miami AU83 
Auburn Fan
Miami
Member since Oct 2007
25218 posts
Online
| re: Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000? (Posted on 10/12/12 at 1:20 pm to Taxing Authority)
quote:
Taxing Authority
Don't like my layman's term definition? I don't care. Guaranteed payment, distribution, salary. It all goes to the owner if he chooses and the owner can control what he/she pays themselves and affect the income that is taxable to the entity itself.
You ever seen an S-corp return? Some authority you are. 
This post was edited on 10/12 at 1:21 pm
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buddhavista
Member since Jul 2012
3543 posts
| re: Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000? (Posted on 10/12/12 at 1:21 pm to Y.A. Tittle)
if they are making 250k+ in net income, then I would suggest your business isn't all that small unless your margins are absolutely sick. But let's say you net margin is 25%, which is really incredibly high for most businesses. This means your are pulling 1M+ in sales. I think that starts to look like an actual business and not a small business.
Oh, and its real easy to hide that $$. Besides skimming, you also can hire your wife, your kids, etc, to funnel money to yourself.
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Taxing Authority
LSU Fan
Houston
Member since Feb 2010
16738 posts
| re: Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000? (Posted on 10/12/12 at 1:21 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83)
quote:
Simple. Cut rates on dividends and cap gains.
Hore shite. That doesn't require anyone write a check and pay a dime to "the rich". That simply allows someone that's earned a return, keep that return. No one else has a claim to it.
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Tiger n Miami AU83
Auburn Fan
Miami
Member since Oct 2007
25218 posts
Online
| re: Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000? (Posted on 10/12/12 at 1:22 pm to LSURussian)
quote:
Do you have a link for that or are you just pulling that answer out of your arse like you usually do?
Find it yourself numbnuts. Lot of lazy people here.
Back to work for me.
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Mid Iowa Tiger 
Iowa State Fan
Houston
Member since Feb 2008
1119 posts
| re: Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000? (Posted on 10/12/12 at 1:24 pm to buddhavista)
quote:
if they are making 250k+ in net income, then I would suggest your business isn't all that small unless your margins are absolutely sick. But let's say you net margin is 25%, which is really incredibly high for most businesses. This means your are pulling 1M+ in sales. I think that starts to look like an actual business and not a small business.
Wrong. Our margins will run around 45% to 55% depending on what we do with marketing expenses in a given year. Also, the last business we had before selling it off was running at about $6 million in revenue before we sold. We had 10 or so employees. Why is that not considered small?
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Taxing Authority
LSU Fan
Houston
Member since Feb 2010
16738 posts
| re: Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000? (Posted on 10/12/12 at 1:26 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83)
quote:
Don't like my layman's term definition? I don't care.
Good thing. Because you "layman's term definition" is simply wrong.
quote:
It all goes to the owner if he chooses and the owner can control what he/she pays themselves and affect the income that is taxable to the entity itself.
Do the math dumbass. You can't simply declare "this income is not taxable". You might want to check out what marginal rates are at the $250,000 level before deciding that paying out business income as salary is a way to avoid taxes.
quote:
You ever seen an S-corp return? Some authority you are
I file one every year.
This post was edited on 10/12 at 1:47 pm
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LSURussian
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Feb 2005
63225 posts
| re: Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000? (Posted on 10/12/12 at 1:27 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83)
quote:
Find it yourself numbnuts.
Translation: "I lied and I got caught lying."
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Draconian Sanctions
LSU Fan
San Francisco 49ers Fan
Member since Oct 2008
28486 posts
| re: Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000? (Posted on 10/12/12 at 1:28 pm to Eighteen)
IMO all small businesses should be exempt from tax increases and health care should be taken totally off employers backs and funded directly by the government for people making less than a certain level.
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Taxing Authority
LSU Fan
Houston
Member since Feb 2010
16738 posts
| re: Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000? (Posted on 10/12/12 at 1:29 pm to buddhavista)
quote:
This means your are pulling 1M+ in sales. I think that starts to look like an actual business and not a small business.
Why isn't a "small" business and "actual" business. You'd be surprised that $1M/yr gross isn't uncommon, nor a big business at all.
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Elcid96
LSU Fan
Member since May 2010
4389 posts
| re: Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000? (Posted on 10/12/12 at 2:00 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83)
quote:
Obama Tax Cuts
FIFY
And yes they should not change.
Please show me where a country has taxed their way into prosperity?
TIA
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buddhavista
Member since Jul 2012
3543 posts
| re: Do 97% of all small businesses really make less than $250,000? (Posted on 10/12/12 at 2:06 pm to Mid Iowa Tiger)
quote:
Wrong. Our margins will run around 45% to 55% depending on what we do with marketing expenses in a given year. Also, the last business we had before selling it off was running at about $6 million in revenue before we sold. We had 10 or so employees. Why is that not considered small?
Well, margins depends on the business doesn't it? I own a small business and have another that I co-own. The one I co-own is probably outside the bounds of small business. Neither is making money right now, so their margins are zero.
I think once you get above 10-15 employees, its no longer small, and there is obviously some revenue cut off also. But maybe that is worth defining what is a small business? And what becomes mid market?
I don't think that has been agreed on, and maybe someone should posit a hypothesis before continuing.
BTW - SBA says less than 500 employees, which I wouldn't consider small at all. I worked for a company that did close to a billion in sales and had under 500 employees. How would that be considered small to anyone I don't know.
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