What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts? - Page 5 - TigerDroppings.com

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Decatur
New Orleans Saints Fan
Member since Mar 2007
17582 posts

re: What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts?


quote:

are you willfully ignoring his want to increase the number of people paying taxes?


so he is going to raise taxes on some people?






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CptBengal
USA Fan
BR Baby
Member since Dec 2007
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re: What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts?


quote:

Furthermore, we have been arguing he can't just count on the economy improving at a significantly faster rate just because he says it will in order to justify his rate cut.


you're right. I;m convinced. We should vote for the guy who has no plan...and wants to increase taxes in a struggling economy.

That'll fix it. GET THE MILLIONAIRES AND BILLIONAIRES!






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Tiger n Miami AU83
Auburn Fan
Miami
Member since Oct 2007
34696 posts

re: What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts?


quote:

can we move past the MSNBC talking point?


It is a bit more than a talking point. In fact it is the single biggest/most important issue or item in this entire election and neither Romneys explanation (or lack thereof) or math makes any sense whatsover.






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tigerfoot
LA-Monroe Fan
Alexandria
Member since Sep 2006
17882 posts

re: What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts?


Who is giving a 20% tax cut?





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Decatur
New Orleans Saints Fan
Member since Mar 2007
17582 posts

re: What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts?


quote:

Who is giving a 20% tax cut?


That's one thing we know about Romney's tax plan

Trying to figure out the rest






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CptBengal
USA Fan
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re: What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts?


quote:

so he is going to raise taxes on some people?



more people working equals more people paying taxes.

BTW, this immensely ignorant schitck you pull is getting old.






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tigerfoot
LA-Monroe Fan
Alexandria
Member since Sep 2006
17882 posts

re: What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts?


quote:

he is going to raise taxes on some people?


So, having a job and paying taxes is a tax INCREASE? Is that your definition. That somehow not having a job and not paying is a better option for the American economy. Holy hell.






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Decatur
New Orleans Saints Fan
Member since Mar 2007
17582 posts

re: What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts?


quote:

We’ll start with the $5 trillion tax cut mystery. At the beginning of the debate, Mr. Obama charged that Mr. Romney’s economic plan calls for a tax reduction of that dollar figure, and that one of the “central questions of the campaign” is how the former Massachusetts governor will pull that off without shifting more of the US tax burden onto the middle class.

Romney said flatly “I don’t have a $5 trillion tax cut.” He said the US should provide tax relief to the middle class, without reducing the share of taxes paid by high-income people.

What’s the story here?

It is true that a central facet of Mitt Romney’s economic plan is a 20 percent across-the-board reduction in marginal tax rates, plus elimination of the estate tax and the alternative minimum tax (AMT). Do the math on how much money the federal government would forgo as a result of this, and it’s about $456 billion a year. Over 10 years, that rounds up to $5 trillion. That's the calculus behind the "$5 trillion tax cut" figure that Obama cites.

However, that’s only part of the tax plan. Romney has said he would make his overall tax changes revenue-neutral. He’d hack out deductions, exemptions, and other exclusions to broaden the tax base, for one thing. For another, he says that lowering marginal rates would increase economic activity, and hence tax revenue. These changes would counterbalance any revenue lost from rate reductions, according to Romney.

Those are ambitious goals, and Romney hasn’t provided more than hints about which deductions and exemptions he’d try to get rid of. Without such specifics to go on, the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center ran the numbers on Romney’s plan, and decided they just don’t add up. A revenue-neutral tax reform that includes 20 percent marginal cuts, no estate tax or AMT, gets rid of a substantial portion of deductions, and keeps existing tax breaks for investments (as Romney has said he would) ends up shifting about $86 billion in annual tax costs onto the middle class, it reported.


LINK






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ottothewise
LSU Fan
Member since Sep 2008
32094 posts

re: What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts?


quote:

For another, he says that lowering marginal rates would increase economic activity, and hence tax revenue. These changes would counterbalance any revenue lost from rate reductions, according to Romney.



unicorns too.






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glaucon
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Aug 2008
4224 posts

re: What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts?


quote:

more people working equals more people paying taxes.

BTW, this immensely ignorant schitck you pull is getting old.


What part of you can't just count on magical economic growth haven't you gotten throughout this whole discussion?






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tigerfoot
LA-Monroe Fan
Alexandria
Member since Sep 2006
17882 posts

re: What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts?


You do know what a marginal tax rate is, don't you?


This post was edited on 10/4 at 3:45 pm


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MFn GIMP
LSU Fan
Owensboro, Kentucky
Member since Feb 2011
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re: What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts?


quote:

In fact it is the single biggest/most important issue or item in this entire election and neither Romneys explanation (or lack thereof) or math makes any sense whatsover.


This Princeton economics professor says otherwise.

LINK

quote:

The main conclusion is that under plausible assumptions, a proposal along the lines suggested by Governor Romney can both be revenue neutral and keep the net tax burden on the upper income classes about the same. That is, an increase in the tax burden on lower and middle income individuals is not required in order to make the overall plan revenue neutral.....

At the same time, the TPC model assumes that regardless of the tax rate, people work the same amount, save the same amount, and invest the same amount. Thus, changes in the tax code have no effect on the amount of before-tax income.4 Because these so-called macro-dynamic behavioral responses are zero, no analysis of tax reform can ever show an increase or decrease in the total level of income in the economy. It follows that the revenue effects of any such changes are constrained to be zero.....

As just noted, I think that for the 2012 law baseline, the low end of the range in the table, 3 percentage points, seems a reasonable figure. This is associated with a $25 billion dollar increase in revenues.
Now let’s sum things up. For the over $100,000 group, the reduction in revenue because of rate cuts is about $144 billion; the increase in revenue due to base broadening is $200 billion; and with a 3 percentage point growth assumption, the additional revenue from a rise in incomes is $25 billion.15 The net impact is a positive $81 billion....

The second row shows analogous computations for taxpayers with incomes of $200,000 or more. Again assuming a 3 percent growth rate, members of this group would pay about $29 billion (or 6.5 percent of current revenues) more in taxes.


Now let's hear the cries that 3% growth is pie in the sky and unheard of.






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CptBengal
USA Fan
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Member since Dec 2007
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re: What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts?


quote:

What part of you can't just count on magical economic growth


3-4% is "magical"?

Obama has certainly given yall lowered expectations.






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MFn GIMP
LSU Fan
Owensboro, Kentucky
Member since Feb 2011
8531 posts
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re: What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts?


Historically, from 1948 until 2012, the United States GDP Annual Growth Rate averaged 3.2 Percent LINK





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glaucon
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Aug 2008
4224 posts

re: What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts?


Look, I can make a great case for Obama if I am just allow to assume that just him being in office and whatever policy he proposes will create great economic growth numbers. That is what you are asking us to believe with Romney's economic plan.





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Decatur
New Orleans Saints Fan
Member since Mar 2007
17582 posts

re: What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts?


quote:

Harvey Rosen, a public finance expert at Princeton, argued that the Romney tax plan will increase economic growth dramatically, which in turn would raise revenue and negate the need for tax increases on the middle-class. He finds that if the Romney plan increases economic growth by 3 percentage points relative to where it would be under current policies — a huge, and many economists think implausible, boost — then Romney’s numbers might work out. But behind his analysis lurk two assumptions that might not add up.

Rosen bases his growth estimates on a study of Romney’s plan done by Rice economist John Diamond. Diamond assumes that Romney’s plan is implemented under conditions of full employment. That’s important because it means that if you eliminate tax breaks for one industry and they have to fire workers, those workers can relatively easily find jobs in another industry. But barring a miraculous labor market recovery in the next few months, that won’t be the situation when Romney takes office. In the current world, wiping out tax breaks for an industry could lead to displaced workers who simply join the ranks of the unemployed, dragging down growth.

But more damaging for Rosen’s case is that Diamond’s study assumes that Romney’s plan is revenue-neutral before you take economic growth into account.* That is, Diamond assumes that the tax cuts have been fully paid for first, and that’s part of why they do so much for growth. Rosen, conversely, is making the case that you don’t need to fully pay for the tax cuts because growth will fill in the gap. So the Diamond-Romney tax plan and the Rosen-Romney tax plan are quite different, and growth estimates that apply to the first don’t necessarily apply to the second.


LINK







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MFn GIMP
LSU Fan
Owensboro, Kentucky
Member since Feb 2011
8531 posts
 Online 

re: What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts?


quote:

Look, I can make a great case for Obama if I am just allow to assume that just him being in office and whatever policy he proposes will create great economic growth numbers.

Yep, the average annual GDP growth rate from 1948-2012 sure is "great" and something we should never expect.






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CptBengal
USA Fan
BR Baby
Member since Dec 2007
39209 posts
 Online 

re: What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts?


quote:

That is what you are asking us to believe with Romney's economic plan.



since Romney cant get in...and sicen you voted for Obama's "hope'n'chnage" strategy in 2008, I find your need for specifics hilarious.






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darkhorse
Member since Aug 2012
6832 posts

re: What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts?


quote:

Just like eating cake and getting skinny



Ah!!! See that's a bad analogy for more than one reason.

1- You can take certain things to offset eating that cake to make ones weight remain the same OR get skinnier... FACT!

2- you are looking at 2 aspects (eating cake and weight) with preconceived ideas. (If you eat cake, you will get fat).








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glaucon
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Aug 2008
4224 posts

re: What tax deductions will Romney eliminate in order to pay for his tax cuts?


quote:


Yep, the average annual GDP growth rate from 1948-2012 sure is "great" and something we should never expect.


Given sustained unemployment over 8%? It is a bit of a stretch and something that even if it happens I don't think you should count as happening due to his rate cut.






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