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CGB Spender
Tulane Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Jun 2012
874 posts

Vilma complaint outlines all aleged flaws in bounty case


PFT




quote:

1.  The refusal to make certain witnesses available at the June 18 appeal hearing;

2.  The failure to deliver the exhibits to be introduced at the June 18 appeal hearing within three days (i.e., 72 hours) of the start of the hearing;

3.  The production of only 16 exhibits consisting of 182 pages from a file that supposedly includes 18,000 total documents and 50,000 total pages;

4.  The failure to produce any notes taken during witness interviews;

5.  The failure to produce original documents;

6.  The refusal to produce any potentially exculpatory evidence;

7.  The reliance on documents generated after the discipline were imposed;

8.  The alleged mischaracterization of the Anthony Hargrove declaration;

9.  The alleged mischaracterization of the Anthony Hargrove video from the 2009 NFC title game;

10.  The alleged mischaracterization of the September 2011 Mike Ornstein email message regarding an alleged $5,000 bounty on Packers quarterback Aaron Rodgers;

11.  The failure to include the September 2011 Mike Ornstein email message in the evidence to be introduced at the appeal hearing;

12.  The alleged mischaracterization of the 2009 email message from Ornstein to Williams, which Vilma claims reflects a commitment by Ornstein to contribute money to Williams’ charitable organization (Ornstein allegedly explained this to Goodell, urging him to confirm it via the charity’s financial documents);

13.  Ornstein’s contradiction of the claim that he corroborated the allegation that Vilma placed a $10,000 bounty on Brett Favre prior to the 2009 NFC title game;

14.  The failure to make Ornstein available to testify at the June 18 appeal hearing or to produce notes of his interview(s);

15.  The strong denial by Saints interim coach Joe Vitt that Vilma placed a bounty on Favre or anyone else;

16.  The failure of the league to disclose that Williams never acknowledged to the NFL the existence of a bounty program;

17.  The alleged problems with the ledger information apparently leaked to Jason Cole of Yahoo! Sports on June 1, 2012, and the failure of the league to introduce the ledger as evidence at the June 18 appeal hearing;

18.  The reliance upon the statements of Mike Cerullo, a disgruntled former Saints employee;

19.  The problems with the typewritten version of handwritten notes regarding the bounty on Vikings quarterback Brett Favre, which Vilma contends were created “well after” the 2009 NFC title game;

20.  The failure to issue a ruling on the appeal by Monday June 25, 2012, one full week after appeal hearings at which Vilma offered no substantive defense.








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Hugo Stiglitz
USA Fan
Disregard Monarchy, Acquire Chicken
Member since Oct 2010
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re: Vilma complaint outlines all aleged flaws in bounty case




ETA: Is that the cigarette smoking man from the X-files?

If so, nice.



This post was edited on 7/1 at 11:54 pm


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Hoodoo Man
LSU Fan
Sunshine Pumping most days.
Member since Oct 2011
16565 posts

re: Vilma complaint outlines all aleged flaws in bounty case


quote:

2. The failure to deliver the exhibits to be introduced at the June 18 appeal hearing within three days (i.e., 72 hours) of the start of the hearing;

This, to me, is the most blatant violation of the CBA.






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THRILLHO
New Orleans Saints Fan
New Orleans, LA
Member since Apr 2006
32770 posts

re: Vilma complaint outlines all aleged flaws in bounty case


quote:

12. The alleged mischaracterization of the 2009 email message from Ornstein to Williams, which Vilma claims reflects a commitment by Ornstein to contribute money to Williams’ charitable organization (Ornstein allegedly explained this to Goodell, urging him to confirm it via the charity’s financial documents);


Had not heard this one. The Ornstein stuff was shady ever since it was shown that he sent it to a middle man first, who then sent it to GW making it pretty clear that he was kind of doing Ornstein a solid simply because he was in jail, and not because there were any serious bounty payments going on. Verifying that some of the "bounties" were simply going to charities would make that evidence pretty much entirely useless.






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Elleshoe
Southeastern LA Fan
Founder of the Boxtard Nation
Member since Jun 2004
121663 posts

re: Vilma complaint outlines all aleged flaws in bounty case


so anyone think any coaches/players get reinstated after all of this?





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Hoodoo Man
LSU Fan
Sunshine Pumping most days.
Member since Oct 2011
16565 posts

re: Vilma complaint outlines all aleged flaws in bounty case


Coaches, definitely not.

Maybe players.






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Hugo Stiglitz
USA Fan
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re: Vilma complaint outlines all aleged flaws in bounty case


i doubt it but it's nice to see Goodell get exposed like this.





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Hugo Stiglitz
USA Fan
Disregard Monarchy, Acquire Chicken
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re: Vilma complaint outlines all aleged flaws in bounty case


fricking iPad double post


This post was edited on 7/1 at 11:59 pm


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THRILLHO
New Orleans Saints Fan
New Orleans, LA
Member since Apr 2006
32770 posts

re: Vilma complaint outlines all aleged flaws in bounty case


Florio, who really knows his shite when it comes to this kind of stuff, thinks it will be a Starcaps type situation where the players, if suspended at all, won't be punished for another year+. That would be good for us since we'll be moving on from Smith and Vilma sooner than later. This will give us more time to prepare for their eventual absences.





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CGB Spender
Tulane Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Jun 2012
874 posts

re: Vilma complaint outlines all aleged flaws in bounty case


Yeah but he also said it won't get hung up as long





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CGB Spender
Tulane Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Jun 2012
874 posts

re: Vilma complaint outlines all aleged flaws in bounty case


Yes it is.







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ATLienTiger
USA Fan
Atlanta
Member since Oct 2006
22026 posts

re: Vilma complaint outlines all aleged flaws in bounty case


So when do you even find out if their suspensions are delayed? Because there isn't too much time between now and camp/pre-season etc.

Also, no chance we get our draft picks back?






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Chrome
LSU Fan
Walker, La
Member since Nov 2007
3049 posts

re: Vilma complaint outlines all aleged flaws in bounty case


Words cannot describe how much I'm loving this.





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Sophandros
New Orleans Saints Fan
Victoria Concordia Crescit
Member since Feb 2005
44183 posts

re: Vilma complaint outlines all aleged flaws in bounty case


I see PFT still has a lot of idiot/fascist commentators...





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TigerinATL
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Member since Feb 2005
30765 posts
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re: Vilma complaint outlines all aleged flaws in bounty case


quote:

so anyone think any coaches/players get reinstated after all of this?


The league needs a scape goat to make that happen. The head investigator already resigned, they've gone too far to blame it all on Cerullo and Goodell isn't going down for this. Hell, he's already earned the owners more money during the next CBA negotiation by making his control of discipline a major issue. Without a viable scapegoat you'd need to get the media enough against Goodell to take him down, which I don't see happening. The best you can hope for is the courts helping the players out. The coaches are SOL.



This post was edited on 7/2 at 8:04 am


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lsutigers1992
New Orleans Saints Fan
Member since Mar 2006
9774 posts
 Online 

re: Vilma complaint outlines all aleged flaws in bounty case


I wonder how many PFT commenters whining about the players refusing to accept Goodell's authority and weaseling their way through the legal system looking for a technicality are the same people who support the Republicans continuing to fight Obamacare even after the Supreme Court made its decision.

This is more of a hypocrisy statement than it is a political statement. I support anyone's rights to fight what they consider to be unjust decisions--not just the ones I personally agree with.



This post was edited on 7/2 at 9:16 am


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goatmilker
New Orleans Saints Fan
2014 drunkin Bobby award winner!
Member since Feb 2009
13241 posts
 Online 

re: Vilma complaint outlines all aleged flaws in bounty case


goodell should just show his birth certificate.





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Swsb44
LSU Fan
Pumpkin Center, LA
Member since Jul 2011
53 posts

re: Vilma complaint outlines all aleged flaws in bounty case


quote:

The best you can hope for is the courts helping the players out.


I agree TigerinATL and unfortunately, the Saints will never have a significant ally in the situation. As you point out the owners aren’t going to kill their golden goose. Since the Saints were a very legitimate Superbowl contender, most NFL fans take pleasure in all of this and it is in their favor for things to work out bad for the Saints. This gives the media all the reason in the world to continue to make the Saints out to be the unprecedented bad guys and not dig for or report evidence that demonstrates that Goodell went much too far, too fast in his destruction of the Saints team.

It is surreal to me that how Goodell has devastated one of the top teams in the NFL with many contradictions, vague allegations, clear evidence (or at least evidence deserving of investigation) that much of his allegations were false, misrepresented or never revealed to anyone. Yet there is no outrage against him or any prominent discussion of the major injustice that has been done to New Orleans. It’s really sad for Saints fans, but because of the reasons stated above and as surreal as it may seem to me nothing positive will happen for the Saints. I don’t think there will be any reduction in any penalty.

It is correct the courts are the only opportunity for justice in this case, but they’ll have to have evidence that the NFL won’t provide or will claim it has destroyed.






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motorbreath
New Orleans Saints Fan
Atlanta Braves Fan
Member since Jun 2004
4155 posts

re: Vilma complaint outlines all aleged flaws in bounty case


All this will come back to bite goodell in the ass. Maybe not any time soon but someday. At the very least it will put a gigantic stain on goodell's tenure as commish.

I can't wait for the tell-all book from Sean Payton after he retires.






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CGB Spender
Tulane Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Jun 2012
874 posts

re: Vilma complaint outlines all aleged flaws in bounty case


quote:

All this will come back to bite goodell in the ass. Maybe not any time soon but someday. At the very least it will put a gigantic stain on goodell's tenure as commish.


Not to mention making the media look stupid by feeding them a bunch of mischaracterizations and, now we know, lies will basically ruin his HOF chances. Once tag gets in, he'll be the only commissioner left out. No one holds a grudge better than a "journalist"

I truly believe he thinks about his legacy with every action he takes. He's trying to leave his mark and say this is how I changed the game for the better (18 game season, rule changes {he doesn't make them but believe me he has big time input}, player conduct policy, bountygate, etc...)

After this his "legacy" is totally fricked



This post was edited on 7/2 at 1:07 pm


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