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Started By
Message
re: New Best EPL Goalkeeper
Posted on 12/11/12 at 2:53 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
Posted on 12/11/12 at 2:53 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
quote:
After reviewing the statistics of all of the keepers who have played max minutes so far this season, Begovic is towards the bottom of the group statistically speaking. EPLindex (a subscription based statistics site) used to show a breakdown of where all the saves were made, and a percentage breakdown of where the shots came from on the field. I can't find that option now.
quote:
Begovic's saves/minute is almost the worst of the group which leads me to believe that Stoke's defense forces a lot of poor shots.
I was right.
quote:
The shots on target he faces in relation to the total shots he faces must be low.
Oh, I was thinking he was saving shots on goal. Saving shots is somewhat irrelevant because I could have a sick save percentage if they are all Sergio Ramos/Neymar PK attempts.
1
Posted on 12/11/12 at 2:57 pm to Vicks Kennel Club
Yea I was right as well. He has made 44 saves and allowed 12 goals. Theoretically that means that out of 195 shots faced, only 56 have been on target. 28%.
Compared to let's say Cech. He has made 57 saves and allowed 17 goals. 74 out of 188 shots on target. 39%.
So on and so on.
This is just another arbitrary metric, but it further hammers home the point I always make: statistics don't paint the whole picture.
Compared to let's say Cech. He has made 57 saves and allowed 17 goals. 74 out of 188 shots on target. 39%.
So on and so on.
This is just another arbitrary metric, but it further hammers home the point I always make: statistics don't paint the whole picture.
This post was edited on 12/11/12 at 2:59 pm
Posted on 12/11/12 at 3:06 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
quote:
This is just another arbitrary metric, but it further hammers home the point I always make: statistics don't paint the whole picture.
It really only does offensively in baseball, and that still leaves a little to be desired.
Statistics generally do a really nice job at painting if you can determine which one matters and why. Certain stats have higher correlations with success and therefore potentially be more valuable.
Context and sample size also matters. I think rate stats sometimes gets overrated because it totally ignores frequency. Frequency can matter more in certain cases because a slightly lower efficiency is worthwhile for high volumes of production, but of course, that is give and take with no true answer.
I love stats and think they really give a great description if you can use them right, but they can also be bent or misrepresented.
Posted on 12/11/12 at 3:13 pm to Vicks Kennel Club
Soccer stats are especially difficult because there are so many unquantifiable areas of the game. Different styles of play, personnel, roles, etc play a big part in skewing stats in favor of certain players/teams when in reality they may not reflect which player/team is better.
Posted on 12/11/12 at 3:29 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
Without a doubt. It is incredibly hard to successfully vacuum stats. I think basketball actually goes too far in this because some of the stats are misleading.
I also do not really look at soccer stats because soccer does not inherently come to me, since I never played and only garnered true interest in 2010. I may have trouble deciphering which stats really matter when it comes to outfield plays. Goalie stats are easy though.
I also do not really look at soccer stats because soccer does not inherently come to me, since I never played and only garnered true interest in 2010. I may have trouble deciphering which stats really matter when it comes to outfield plays. Goalie stats are easy though.
Posted on 12/11/12 at 5:24 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
quote:
After reviewing the statistics of all of the keepers who have played max minutes so far this season, Begovic is towards the bottom of the group statistically speaking. EPLindex (a subscription based statistics site) used to show a breakdown of where all the saves were made, and a percentage breakdown of where the shots came from on the field. I can't find that option now.
Could you link where on the EPLindex site where you saw the stats for the keepers? I believe what you're saying I would just like to look at it as well for future references.
I found this article on the EPLindex site just by searching Begovic.
Top EPL Keeper Comparison
It covers alot of what we've been discussing. His conclusion at the end of the article:
quote:
The original question posed at the beginning of the article; is Asmir Begovic the best goalkeeper in the Premier League? Is he even one of the best? I believe that over the last twelve months Begovic has not only cemented his place in the Stoke line-up, but also amongst the top three goalkeepers in the Premier League along with Joe Hart and Petr Cech. Why else would he be targeted by the country’s top clubs?
Posted on 12/11/12 at 5:32 pm to SuperSoakher
It's a subscription based site.
Posted on 12/11/12 at 7:22 pm to SuperSoakher
Pretty much every one of those stats you listed is considered an inferior statistic when comparing players today.
Posted on 12/11/12 at 9:23 pm to Vicks Kennel Club
quote:
I may have trouble deciphering which stats really matter when it comes to outfield plays.
A major stat being thrown about recently is second-pass completion percentage. It's a good metric for determining how a player impacts possession. Explained here
I imagine guys like Xavi and Busquets have insanely high rates in this metric.
I wish I could find the secondary completion stats for Jermaine Jones. I've seen him give other players "hospital balls" way too many times.
Posted on 12/11/12 at 9:39 pm to thenry712
Didn't read the link. But is "second pass" similar to "second assist" or "key pass"?
Posted on 12/11/12 at 9:46 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
quote:
Didn't read the link. But is "second pass" similar to "second assist" or "key pass"?
It's like if I pass it to you, you get it perfectly, and then successfully pass it to someone else.
That's a second pass for me.
A hospital ball is when you make a pass that results in the receiver getting crushed.
Both of these result in completed passes on a stat sheet, but a second pass percentage shows how good your passes are.
This post was edited on 12/11/12 at 9:49 pm
Posted on 12/11/12 at 9:48 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
Not really. It's a rate showing the percentage of time a player's completed pass leads to its target player completing the ensuing pass.
Typically defenders in possession oriented sides will lead in that metric, because they get the most unopposed passes. It's better to ignore those players and look at the midfield leaders.
Typically defenders in possession oriented sides will lead in that metric, because they get the most unopposed passes. It's better to ignore those players and look at the midfield leaders.
This post was edited on 12/11/12 at 9:49 pm
Posted on 12/11/12 at 10:10 pm to thenry712
Ahh I see. I'll read the link tonight.
Posted on 12/12/12 at 6:40 am to SuperSoakher
quote:
Also about Lloris, Friedel has played almost twice as many more minutes in goal than Lloris. I haven't watched many Tottenham games, so I don't know if he's injured or what.
I think at this point it's safe to say that Lloris is the permanent starter. Friedel got the same treatment that Joleon Lescott is getting from Roberto Mancini. Did absolutely nothing to lose his job, but the manager just wanted his guy in goal.
__________________
I've always been impressed with Ali al-Habsi at Wigan. I'd like to see what he could do at a top of the table club in the EPL.
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