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re: General NBA Links
Posted on 4/15/14 at 9:45 am to TigerinATL
Posted on 4/15/14 at 9:45 am to TigerinATL
I just think you have to put the ball in Tyrekes hands. He's too strong for smaller guards, and too quick for bigger guards. He's shown a chemistry with AD that I haven't seen with Jrue(albeit a small sample).
I know you want either one of them on the floor at all times, but we need to make it work in the offseason to where we have an adequate 1 coming off the bench, maybe Pierre?
I know you want either one of them on the floor at all times, but we need to make it work in the offseason to where we have an adequate 1 coming off the bench, maybe Pierre?
2
Posted on 4/15/14 at 9:51 am to Gtothemoney
quote:
where we have an adequate 1 coming off the bench, maybe Pierre?
I don't think we can count on Pierre for anything at this point. Yeah he was unbelievable in the DLeague, but he didn't last long in Turkey.
quote:
Jackson left in late February for Fenerbahce Ulker Istanbul, but failed to make any impact overseas. According to Hurriyet, Jackson and Fenerbahce have parted ways. Jackson played in only six games for Fenerbahce and scored a combined 20 points and dished out a mere 8 assists. For someone who looked poised to make an impact at the NBA level, Jackson seemed out of place overseas and struggled to adjust to the different style of play that European basketball has.
LINK
If Pierre translates to the NBA he's a ball dominant scoring guard, not a point guard. I don't think Rivers is a good PG in the traditional sense, but he is a good game manager and I'd be fine with him as the backup PG.
This post was edited on 4/15/14 at 9:53 am
Posted on 4/15/14 at 10:45 am to Gtothemoney
quote:
He's shown a chemistry with AD that I haven't seen with Jrue(albeit a small sample).
In fairness, Tyreke started the year with a very noticeable lack of chemistry with Davis. What he has shown has been a fairly recent trend. Jrue didn't get that time to mesh. I think we're again getting bogged down by the concept that a player plays one position and only one position. In today's game, you see switches on defense. You see different guys take the point on different possessions to keep the defense off balance. I think you'll see Tyreke initiating more with Jrue off the ball, but that doesn't mean it will be the only way we play offense.
Derek Fisher just hit the deck again.
Posted on 4/15/14 at 10:46 am to TigerinATL
It will be interesting to see what Jackson can do in summer league this year.
Posted on 4/15/14 at 10:53 am to Galactic Inquisitor
quote:I agree. But I also still find it weird how often people talk about this like its new. Ron Harper won 5 championships playing "point guard," for example.
I think we're again getting bogged down by the concept that a player plays one position and only one position. In today's game, you see switches on defense. You see different guys take the point on different possessions to keep the defense off balance. I think you'll see Tyreke initiating more with Jrue off the ball, but that doesn't mean it will be the only way we play offense.
Posted on 4/15/14 at 11:13 am to eyeran
Zach Lowe's awards ballot . I post this mainly, well only, to complain...
A few days ago he says AD is by far the most improved player in the league. But basically hinted that he was going with the, "not going to vote for the number 1 pick in the draft for most improved player," stance. I don't agree with that, but fine.
"In a very literal sense, Anthony Davis is quite clearly the most improved player in the league." "I don't think he's going to win it...he was a number one draft pick, this was expected development." "I think he's obviously, literally, the guy who's improved most over last year." "I don't think he's going to win it..."
Then his list comes out and its, Dragic, Demarcus Cousins, and a Morris twin.
Top 5 pick...
A few days ago he says AD is by far the most improved player in the league. But basically hinted that he was going with the, "not going to vote for the number 1 pick in the draft for most improved player," stance. I don't agree with that, but fine.
"In a very literal sense, Anthony Davis is quite clearly the most improved player in the league." "I don't think he's going to win it...he was a number one draft pick, this was expected development." "I think he's obviously, literally, the guy who's improved most over last year." "I don't think he's going to win it..."
Then his list comes out and its, Dragic, Demarcus Cousins, and a Morris twin.
Top 5 pick...
Posted on 4/15/14 at 12:11 pm to eyeran
If you look at MIP awards, the improvement comes in the season awarded or the season before, and it's about an even split.
As a result, I view the MIP awards as more of a media "oops" award, but rather than saying "My bad," they say "Uh oh, Happy learned how to putt."
Lowe's comment seems to support the incongruity between the name and award basis.
As a result, I view the MIP awards as more of a media "oops" award, but rather than saying "My bad," they say "Uh oh, Happy learned how to putt."
Lowe's comment seems to support the incongruity between the name and award basis.
Posted on 4/15/14 at 12:27 pm to Galactic Inquisitor
Re: Evans and Jrue, GI nails it for me.
Evans is best with the ball in his hands, but that doesn't mean he has to play the "Paul" role or that Jrue should be strictly off ball.
Ideally, the scheme and players should be flexible enough to create opportunities for the talents of Evans and Holiday (and Gordon?) in a symbiotic way rather than the ball stopping we saw a lot of this year.
More flow rather than "my turn, your turn" dueling banjo action.
quote:
getting bogged down by the concept that a player plays one position and only one position
Evans is best with the ball in his hands, but that doesn't mean he has to play the "Paul" role or that Jrue should be strictly off ball.
Ideally, the scheme and players should be flexible enough to create opportunities for the talents of Evans and Holiday (and Gordon?) in a symbiotic way rather than the ball stopping we saw a lot of this year.
More flow rather than "my turn, your turn" dueling banjo action.
This post was edited on 4/15/14 at 12:34 pm
Posted on 4/15/14 at 3:29 pm to corndeaux
Zach Lowe has started his own podcast (The Lowe Post). Naturally, excellent so far. The most recent one has RC Buford talking about Spurs.
LINK
Simmons also had a good one recently with NBA guru Haralabos Voulgaris. No link, but available on itunes or simple Google search
LINK
Simmons also had a good one recently with NBA guru Haralabos Voulgaris. No link, but available on itunes or simple Google search
Posted on 4/15/14 at 4:12 pm to corndeaux
Of course Paul Flannery says in one quip everything I've been trying to say about the Evans signing.
From Zillers non traditional year end awards.
LINK
quote:
Tyreke Evans got what, to do what? And you gave away Robin Lopez to make it happen? Good plan. -- Flannery
From Zillers non traditional year end awards.
LINK
Posted on 4/15/14 at 4:25 pm to corndeaux
quote:
Tyreke Evans got what
$11 million per year
quote:
to do what?
To outshine the league MVP
quote:
And you gave away Robin Lopez to make it happen?
He wasn't given away, he was traded for Withey. How good will Withey be in 2 years? He's got a PER of 15 which is unusually high for a Rookie. He'll probably be a better defender and rim protecter than Lopez and they are similarly mediocre at rebounding. The Pelicans gave up 15/8/2 per 36. Jeff Withey is already matching the rebounds and blocks, and is only 5 pts behind at 10 per 36. So again I ask you to put on your future glasses and look at the year 2015, Withey will quite possibly be similarly productive to Lopez only he'll still be on his rookie deal or ready to start a cheap 2nd contract rather than ending a $5 million per year deal and probably looking for a raise.
Posted on 4/15/14 at 4:52 pm to TigerinATL
I've just resigned myself to the fact that people are going to look at the Pelicans record this year and deem the moves they made a failure. No context involved.
No looking to the future or the fact that the core of the team is all 25 and under, so this wasn't "win now" like many love to claim.
Specifically regarding Evans, he's going to end this season with the highest PER of his career. Same with Jrue Holiday. Anderson was having the best year of his career. And then there's Davis...
It wasn't the structure of the team, but the injuries, that doomed them.
I also love the player Robin Lopez has turned into, in people's eyes. He was halfway out of the league when we brought him in from Phoenix, no he's some irreplaceable championship piece, apparently. He found a nice fit on a team that's started 6 guys and 2 lineups all year. They better be good.
No looking to the future or the fact that the core of the team is all 25 and under, so this wasn't "win now" like many love to claim.
Specifically regarding Evans, he's going to end this season with the highest PER of his career. Same with Jrue Holiday. Anderson was having the best year of his career. And then there's Davis...
It wasn't the structure of the team, but the injuries, that doomed them.
I also love the player Robin Lopez has turned into, in people's eyes. He was halfway out of the league when we brought him in from Phoenix, no he's some irreplaceable championship piece, apparently. He found a nice fit on a team that's started 6 guys and 2 lineups all year. They better be good.
Posted on 4/15/14 at 4:56 pm to TigerinATL
quote:
Tyreke Evans got what
$11 million per year
quote:
to do what?
To play ~25 MPG, many of them with Greg Stiemsma.
quote:
To outshine the league MVP
After every other conceivable option on offense was indisposed. To his credit, he delivered.
quote:
He wasn't given away, he was traded for Withey
By a team who almost immediately decried their lack of frontcourt players and mismanaged Evans, the primary asset
quote:
How good will Withey be in 2 years?
Dunno. Stiemsma had a solid rookie year in limited minutes in Boston too.
quote:
future glasses
I get that and dont dispute that.
My faith that Evans and even a developed Withey will be used with much intelligence has been tested based on what we saw this year.
Is that really not a fair assessment? The team didn't pull a Posey, but it hasn't been a promising start with this deal. But certainly time to turn it around
Posted on 4/15/14 at 5:00 pm to eyeran
quote:
I also love the player Robin Lopez has turned into, in people's eyes
No one with any sense believes that Lopez is a stud.
He's still got plenty of flaws. But he's a decent center on a good contract.
If you're moving him to pay Evans $44M to play 25MPG, then complain about not having enough good options in the middle, I have some problems
Posted on 4/15/14 at 5:03 pm to corndeaux
quote:
If you're moving him to pay Evans $44M to play 25MPG, then complain about not having enough good options in the middle, I have some problems
This plan was fricked from the start. That is the problem.
Evans is not Manu, and Monty is not Pop.
This post was edited on 4/15/14 at 5:04 pm
Posted on 4/15/14 at 5:12 pm to corndeaux
quote:My problem is believing Lopez solved the problems we had/have. How have we forgotten how awful he was defensively? And he's still not a good. Actually has the same same 107 drtg as Steimsma with Portland giving up more points than we do.
If you're moving him to pay Evans $44M to play 25MPG, then complain about not having enough good options in the middle, I have some problems
Like ATL said, Withey's the same mediocre rebounder as Lopez with the potential to be a much better rim protector.
I'd make that deal a million times over.
This post was edited on 4/15/14 at 6:09 pm
Posted on 4/15/14 at 5:20 pm to corndeaux
quote:
My faith that Evans and even a developed Withey will be used with much intelligence has been tested based on what we saw this year.
I agree, but hopefully enough shite has hit the fan and enough trust has been earned for Monty to do a better job of roster usage. I also would be very happy if Demps didn't sign/resign a single bench player over 25.
quote:
Is that really not a fair assessment? The team didn't pull a Posey, but it hasn't been a promising start with this deal
I think there is definitely reason for concern because Monty. But I also think you've had a year for guys like Tyreke, Rivers, Ajinca and Withey to earn his trust. And in the short time we saw the Finishing Five together, Monty seemed to go against his normal inclinations, because the Finishing Five was horrid defensively, but they were even more brilliant on offense and he looked like he was getting into a pattern of running those guys together the last 5 minutes of quarters.
quote:
But certainly time to turn it around
The problem is the coach, not the roster (outside of Gordon). I will only be concerned if they can't move Gordon before his contract is up. Considering all the options, that would be a fireable offense. Demps has to add another good starter level player before AD's new contract kicks in.
Posted on 4/15/14 at 5:22 pm to Gtothemoney
quote:"Smart people" said that would be an ideal use for him.
This plan was fricked from the start. That is the problem.
And for a stretch, it was actually going great. From the end of November through the beginning of January, he was playing excellent off the bench. Its no coincidence that that was the small stretch of the season when we actually had our core group together, and he had Anderson coming off the bench with him. Which was the plan all along.
Posted on 4/15/14 at 7:28 pm to eyeran
quote:
My problem is believing Lopez solved the problems we had/have
Not saying this at all
I've said 3 separate times, Lopez has flaws. He is the same type of player as Withey, Stiemsma, and Ajinca- slow, not much of a threat on offense, good shot blocker (Lopez was top 10 in the league-just behind Davis- last year in BLK%.
It's not really about his skills, but rather asset management. Even if you know he isn't the guy you want, his contract continues to hold value beyond last summer.
Why dump him to spend that much on a guard whom you will then use improperly, limiting his effectiveness while also damaging his attractiveness in a potential trade?
I liked the trade when it happened. I like the trade in a vacuum. It can still work, but the way it played out this year, ALL things considered, leaves me cold
quote:
Monty seemed to go against his normal inclinations, because the Finishing Five was horrid defensively, but they were even more brilliant on offense and he looked like he was getting into a pattern of running those guys together the last 5 minutes of quarters.
This is a fair point and something I had forgotten.
quote:
Smart people" said that would be an ideal use for him.
I think he can still work off the bench given Montys insistence on rolling out 5 bench guys at a time for stretches.
But he needs non unholy trio guys around him and 30+ MPG (moving Gordon makes it harder for Monty to screw it up) I don't believe he was getting that even with Monty's modified rotations.
Posted on 4/15/14 at 9:21 pm to corndeaux
quote:And I think Tyreke Evans and Withey are fine value for a replacement-level big.
It's not really about his skills, but rather asset management. Even if you know he isn't the guy you want, his contract continues to hold value beyond last summer.
quote:I just don't know what was to be expected when they barely got a chance to work it out. And the small period they had together, it actually was working.
I liked the trade when it happened. I like the trade in a vacuum. It can still work, but the way it played out this year, ALL things considered, leaves me cold
Tyreke was good when we had our guys healthy, then great once he hit the starting lineup. I don't question his season. Plus the numbers show he was really good with Holiday. So that's encouraging, going forward.
I specifically remember a thread during our short "healthy" period where we both agreed Monty had totally changed his philosophy, if we want to call it that.
We were top 10 in pace, lighting up the scoreboard, and the Holiday, Gordon, Evans, Anderson, Davis lineup was starting to get more and more minutes, not just closing out games together(which is how they were used initially). Regardless of how bad the defense was. Seemed most were optimistic about the direction they were headed. And this was before Anthony Davis really went big bang.
Everything didn't go to shite until the injuries started to pile up. From that point, they were juggling minutes for guys they pulled out of rec leagues. Guys who won't be here in October.
I can't help but be optimistic about our outlook going forward. The toughest part of our roster building is over. We have a superstar and a core group of young players, still improving, surrounding him. Now we've just got to add suitable fillers. A middle of the road big man. Morrow staying would be nice. Austin's continued improvement could lock up the backup pg job. A SF that could, at the very least, stand in the corner and hit a drive and kick 3. After that we're just looking for guys to wear warm up suits.
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