What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage - Page 15 - TigerDroppings.com

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LSUFreek
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re: What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage


quote:

And ive not read a more graphic book filled with love, tolerance, mercy, historical facts, miracles, and genius that flow perfectly together


Yeah, I didn't read anything close to LOVE when god murdered via drowning innocent newborn infants, toddlers, children, puppies, cats, lions, tigers, bears, (and somehow the birds, too ) for the wickedness of adult humans when he flooded the earth (Gen 6:7, 17). Not sure how you didn't read it as anything other than unjust cruelty, irrational vengeance & insane hate.


I didn't read about any MERCY when god threatened to have David's multiple wives raped in broad daylight for David's sin, then after David repents, is granted forgiveness but insisted David's on-the-way innocent baby die a slow week-long death (2 Sam 12:11-18). Why you people read that as anything but unmerciful, cruel, and sadistic is mind-boggling.

I didn't read anything scientifically factual when I read that God considers bats to be an unclean bird (Lev 11:13, 19 & Deut 14:11, 18 ) Even adolescents know bats are mammals, and don't lay eggs. Or that time when God will gather up the people of Judea "from the four corners of the earth" (Isaiah 11:12), you know because the earth is flat.

I didn't read anything as miraculous when god sent two bears to rip up 42 little children for making fun of Elisha's bald head. (2 Kings 2:23-24) Sounded cruel, evil, & spiteful to me. Nothing miraculous there to applaud, praise, or honor.

There was nothing I read that sounded GENIUS in God's plan to have a chosen people because he said an uncircumcised boy is to be abandoned by his parents and community. (Gen 17:14) Or how genius is it to create a law that states if a woman being raped doesn't yell loud enough during the rape, she is to be put to death (Deut. 22:23-24) In what way should I praise that genius mind? Creativity for injustice & cruelty?

I didn't read about any TOLERANCE when god decreed if a man has sex with another man to kill them both. (Lev 20:13). Sounds like the definition of intolerance to me.


Because I actually read the Bible & comprehended it, I could literally go thru every verse from cover-to-cover and show you the cruelty, injustice, intolerance violence, hate, evilness attributed to God. You see, I am actually defending God. An all-loving, all-merciful GOD could not commit the unforgivable crimes he's alleged to have committed. How you people gloss over this evil and chose to praise him for it is incomprehensible. Then you randomly cherry-pick a verse from either testament and conveniently deem it relevant to justify & inflict your intolerant political views on other adults is stupefying.






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Tiguar
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re: What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage


You have no ground to say what is just and unjust in the context of talking about gods actions. The logic may be circular but that is the logic used. Wasted post.





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Revelator
Member since Nov 2008
14435 posts

re: What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage


quote:

If you're referencing Sodom and Gomorrah, you're most likely wrong. Take a few Greek language classes and you'll understand. Its the most disputed translation in the bible by scholars.





I wasn't talking about Sodom and Gomorrah specifically, more like;

Leviticus 20:13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood [shall be] upon them


And it would probably do anybody well to understand some Greek while reading the New Testament, but that wouldn't help in the Old since it was written in Hebrew.




This post was edited on 7/5 at 1:13 pm


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BleedPurpleGold
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New Orleans
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re: What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage


quote:

And it would probably do anybody well to understand some Greek while reading the New Testament, but that wouldn't help in the Old since it was written in Hebrew.


Hebrew ---> Greek ---> Latin






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LSUFreek
LSU Fan
Greater New Orleans
Member since Jan 2007
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re: What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage


quote:

You have no ground to say what is just and unjust in the context of talking about gods actions


Says who?

In what universe does murdering innocent children get a "JUST" rating? I don't care if this theoretical God considers it "just", he'll be the only one that does, outside of pathological serial killers. And any god that commits this abhorrent evil, deserves no recognition as a god or the illogical praise of greatness & goodness from his apologists.







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Revelator
Member since Nov 2008
14435 posts

re: What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage


quote:

In what universe does murdering innocent children get a "JUST" rating? I don't care if this theoretical God considers it "just", he'll be the only one that does, outside of pathological serial killers. And any god that commits this abhorrent evil, deserves no recognition as a god or the illogical praise of greatness & goodness from his apologists.
.



If you had the capability to know who would commit a crime or become a murderer like on Minority Report, some of these killings would make sense in a preemptive fashion. And that's just one simple example coming from a finite mind. Who knows the complexity of understanding based on foreknowledge that God could have? There might be things that he can access that we don't even know anything about and don't even exist in the realm of human understanding. We always try to explain all his actions based on things we understand and know, but undoubtedly a being that could create everything seen an unseen would have access to knowledge and means outside of our understanding?



This post was edited on 7/5 at 1:56 pm


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EvrybodysAllAmerican
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Death Valley
Member since Apr 2013
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re: What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage


Sorry you feel that way. But I think you're still cherry picking verses to justify your dislike for the Bible.
When you look at it as a whole work- God's relationship and forgiveness towards mankind as a whole, in spite of how men have continued to turn their back on Him, then you see the love, mercy, tolerance, genius, etc. I was talking about.
All of your verses are cherry picked from the Old testement, which is a different animal than the new testement-A lot of it is God's instructions specifically for the Jews, and it can sound cruel when you dont view it as a whole, with God's plan for them in mind. My personal belief (others may disagree) and a big part of what you seem to be misunderstanding, is those early laws were intended to sort of "set the tone" for the early Israelites, so they and more importantly future generations would understand that God was serious about sin, and doesnt wink and overlook it. For thousands of years the Israelites weaved in and out of God's will and His blessings (just as we do today), and those old testement stories are a microcosm of the same struggles we face in life today. It was harsh but it had a purpose for God's perfect plan.
Jesus came in the New Testement to fulfill the old testement, as a savior for the Jews. The jews rejected Him, so he became a savior for the gentiles. Once you have Jesus, everything changes. He is the atonement for sins. No more need for the old testement laws=Thus you have God's love, mercy, genius and tolerance that i stated earlier.

Ps: Rex, thanks for weighing in on this. That should tell the rational thinkers on this board which side is correct.

Just kidding....sort of.



This post was edited on 7/5 at 5:00 pm


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S.E.C. Crazy
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re: What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage


( Not at all. I am using Jesus own words as a gotcha)

Except you don't gotcha because if you read the whole chapter you would better understand that your gotcha is ill gotten.


The scribes and pharisses came to Jesus asking him why didn't his diciples wash their hands before eating as the law requires, to which J.C. replied: you hypocrites , do you keep all the laws ? It is commanded that if your children curse their parents they should be put to death , but you do not uphold this law but rather your traditions.

Latter in the chapter Jesus says, It is not that from the outside which defiles you, but that which comes from the inside.

On the other point you made.

Jesus said he wasn't come to destroy the law, but to FULFILL the law.( In other words all Israel was still under the law , until the time that J.C. would FULFILL the law.

Then J.C. said, not one jot, nor title will pass from the law untill all be fullfilled.

NOTICE TO EARTH:

Jesus stated I have come to FULFILL the law, ( blood sacrifice required for sinners) mission accomplished on an Old Rugged Cross some 2000 years ago.






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EvrybodysAllAmerican
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Death Valley
Member since Apr 2013
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re: What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage


quote:

If you had the capability to know who would commit a crime or become a murderer like on Minority Report, some of these killings would make sense in a preemptive fashion. And that's just one simple example coming from a finite mind.


This is a good analogy. There were several times in the old Testement when God told the Israelites to do something they didnt really understand why, they disobeyed and it came back to hurt them later.






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LSUFreek
LSU Fan
Greater New Orleans
Member since Jan 2007
7804 posts

re: What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage


quote:

All of your verses are cherry picked from the Old testement, which is a different animal than the new testement-


First of all, I am not cherry picking. This format does not allow a verse by verse analytical dissection of each horrific action attributed to God. So I could easily shine a light on the atrocities & errors of all the verses in both the OT and NT if time and space allotted.

My point about homophobic intolerant christians is that they cherry pick from the Old Testament and use it amongst the extreme orthodox as a rallying cry for "Death to Fags", or less extreme, as disguised homophobia. And then conveniently say "oh, the Old Testament laws no longer apply" when faced with the unethical crimes of their God of Goodness & Love. Then why have those irrelevant OT books in there? His heinous actions throughout were worse than Hitler. Tear out those pages.






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EvrybodysAllAmerican
LSU Fan
Death Valley
Member since Apr 2013
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re: What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage


You are certainly cherry picking. And i gave you a nice overview of the whole Bible in return.

Im pretty sure you have never heard a legitimate Christian say this-
quote:

"Death to Fags",
Jesus was a "friend of sinners" To be Christian (Christ-like) contradicts that attitude and i would condemn that as well. I cringe when Christians are judgemental, forgetting where we came from, and it surely happens too much-myself included.
But loving sinners is different than excusing sin. It doesnt mean we shouldnt stand up for things like family values and protecting the lives of unborn babies.



This post was edited on 7/5 at 2:38 pm


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LSUFreek
LSU Fan
Greater New Orleans
Member since Jan 2007
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re: What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage


quote:

some of these killings would make sense in a preemptive fashion.


Yeah, preemptive justice!!! David's unborn innocent son might have grown up into some serial killer like God who could maniacally drown infants, puppies, & cute koala bears...even though god gave free will to everyone, and the son could have not committed those crimes. But now I understand why god gave him a seven day slow death for a sin David committed! Go on Jehovah, kill that possible future-maniac infant!

His actions were indefensible and criminal. To apologize for him is with "God works preemptively in mysterious ways" is as inept as it is illogical.






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TK421
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Oct 2011
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re: What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage


quote:

If you're referencing Sodom and Gomorrah, you're most likely wrong. Take a few Greek language classes and you'll understand. Its the most disputed translation in the bible by scholars.


I'm not sure what Greek has to do with anything. The original language was Hebrew.

As far as Sodom and Gomorrah go, Ezekiel specifically states why they were destroyed and it had nothing to do with homosexuality.

quote:

he's completely correct in the argument about what Jesus said about insolent children. If you read the book in its entirety its actually pretty easy to see that.


Yeah. Lots of stupid coming from the "smart" atheist side in this thread.






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LSUFreek
LSU Fan
Greater New Orleans
Member since Jan 2007
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re: What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage


quote:

Im pretty sure you have never heard a legitimate Christian say this- "Death to Fags"


No as I said, I've heard extreme christians say that. And as I also said, I have heard countless homophobic christians cite the Bible (even OT scripture) as reasoning for disallowing gay marriage, "...because God the act! Here read it in Romans. Queers shouldn't marry. It's an abomination. God says it's worthy of death"

To make matters worse, most of them are fellow Libertarians like me, who whole-heartedly believe in the sovereign rights of an individual and his pursuit of happiness. And yet they want to impose limits on consenting adults to their freedoms via the federal government. How hypocritical and shameful!






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S.E.C. Crazy
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re: What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage


Jesus condoning such an immoral act !!!!!!!!

So Gods laws are immoral because the Freek says so ?

I have explained this already in this thread , but I guess you missed it.


The was no imparting of the holy spirit until J.C. came and died , the Jewish people had to wait upon the planned out sacrifice to rid themselves of their evil sins.

When Israel conquerd lands , God commanded them to slay all the men, women and children lest their evil come upon them.

God commanded witches to be killed and yes rebellious children, to keep evil and rebelliousness out of the midst of Gods choosen people.Satan rebeled.

We now live under Grace , but look at what rebellious children , left to their vain imaginations, have accomplish in a society (USA) in just 50 years !!!!!!!!!!: The born out of wedlock percentages skyrocket, as does STDS, promiscuity , kids running parents lives , the percentages of robberies, theft and all forms of crimes have skyrocketed since the 1960s counter culture movement, the prison population has skyrocketed.

How long would Israel have lasted and/or could they have been Gods holy people, if they had allowed rebellious kids to rule them ?

You , nor anyone knows or can know God in full , but with a little effort you can deduce the facts.

And about someone asking if God created evil , God being perfect created man and angels perfect , with this perfection has to come free will , thus the chance for rebelliousness.

Just because God knew some angels and man would rebel , does not mean God created any being evil , he created both angels and man perfect.

Why should God not have created the angels because he knew 1/3 of them would rebel(become evil) ?


Why should God not create man?






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BleedPurpleGold
LSU Fan
New Orleans
Member since Apr 2005
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re: What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage


quote:

I'm not sure what Greek has to do with anything. The original language was Hebrew.


And what language did the writers of the bible speak? The Old Testament was translated from Hebrew to Greek to Latin. The translation discrepancy occurred between the first two.

quote:

As far as Sodom and Gomorrah go, Ezekiel specifically states why they were destroyed and it had nothing to do with homosexuality


Agreed, which is why I don't understand why its being used here.

Also, Paul's letter to the Corinthians was in Greek. His admonishment of homosexual behavior used the same terms used in the translation above. Most modern day Greek scholars say his use never was intended to mean what we think it does.



This post was edited on 7/5 at 2:49 pm


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BleedPurpleGold
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re: What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage


quote:

Why should God not have created the angels because he knew 1/3 of them would rebel(become evil) ?


That was a choice. Being attracted to the same sex is not a choice.






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LSUFreek
LSU Fan
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Member since Jan 2007
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re: What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage


quote:


This is a good analogy. There were several times in the old Testement when God told the Israelites to do something they didnt really understand why, they disobeyed and it came back to hurt them later.


Its not a good analogy at all.

Those people had free will to make the wrong choice. What choice did David's unborn son have when he got his death sentence by 7-day torture? What wrong decision did those infants, toddlers and adolescents drowned inn the flood make?






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S.E.C. Crazy
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re: What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage


Being a husband who cheats on his wife is a choice.

Being a homosexual is a choice.

By your definition , anything the evil heart of man desires can be blamed on genetics.

MUST BE TRUE WITH AUBURN FANS .






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LSUFreek
LSU Fan
Greater New Orleans
Member since Jan 2007
7804 posts

re: What churches simply dont get on Gay Marriage


quote:

When Israel conquerd lands , God commanded them to slay all the men, women and children lest their evil come upon them.

Praise God for his mercy and love. How sweet he is!!

quote:

God commanded witches to be killed and yes rebellious children, to keep evil and rebelliousness out of the midst of Gods choosen people.Satan rebeled.

Death to the witches and rebellious children! Oh that's so genius, and our wicked courts have fallen so far from grace. Please, my sweet savior, bring back Salem's Lot!

quote:

How long would Israel have lasted and/or could they have been Gods holy people, if they had allowed rebellious kids to rule them ?

I agree. The children are our future. Oh, my Merciful God, please kill all those juvenile delinquents in those detention centers. And not just them, please my sweet loving one, kill those disobedient kids at homes who refuse to cut the lawn.

quote:

Jesus condoning such an immoral act !!!!!!!!

So Gods laws are immoral because the Freek says so ?


Yes, because murdering innocent kids, abandoning them because they didn't get circumcised, and mauling 42 of them because they made fun of a bald man is.....oh, how do I put this..... immoral on any level. If that's divine, there are serial killers that are holier than God. The fact that you would defend these cruel malicious actions by a "god" makes me question your IQ.






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