Analyzing Pelican Players and How to Fit Talents Together - Page 3 - TigerDroppings.com

Posted byMessage
corndeaux
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Member since Sep 2009
5338 posts

re: Analyzing Pelican Players and How to Fit Talents Together


So everything inside the lane can be Inside Scoring, outside the lane to the 3pt line is Md, and 3 is 3.

Green is above league average, Yellow is about league average, and Red is below league average

Didn't include Mason (would be surprised if he sticks around) or Miller (sample size)

Vasquez Shot Chart



So Md and 3?

Anderson Shot Chart



Md and 3?

Anthony Davis



Inside Scoring?

Eric Gordon



3? Would like to reward him for getting to the line so much, but not sure if it works for Inside Scoring- maybe Fearless?

Aminu



Inside Scoring?

Lopez



Inside and Md?

Rivers



:(

Roberts



3 and Md?

Smiht



Inside and Md?






Back to top
Jester
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Feb 2006
17459 posts

re: Analyzing Pelican Players and How to Fit Talents Together


So, Vasquez is good from both corners? Seems like he could very well play off of Gordon handling.

People keep saying we need a spacer in the corners on Gordon's drives. It looks like Vasquez provides exactly that.






Back to top
42
New Orleans Saints Fan
Member since Apr 2012
3574 posts

re: Analyzing Pelican Players and How to Fit Talents Together


LINK /

A ton of Aminu data.






Back to top
  Replies (0)
GynoSandberg
LA-Lafayette Fan
Member since Jan 2006
34248 posts
 Online 

re: Analyzing Pelican Players and How to Fit Talents Together


27 attempts from the corner in 78 games tells the whole story for you?

The year before he was 5/21 from the corners (24%)

Hardly evidence that he is a "corner spacer", no? And if he was such a good corner shooter, who OK'd him taking 211 shots from the top of the key at a 32% clip? Why not run plays to set him up for the corner 3?






Back to top
Jester
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Feb 2006
17459 posts

re: Analyzing Pelican Players and How to Fit Talents Together


quote:

27 attempts from the corner in 78 games tells the whole story for you?


Well, considering I can't magically create another 140 attempts, yes, that IS the whole story.

quote:

The year before he was 5/21 from the corners (24%)


Because players never work in the offseason and improve....

quote:

Hardly evidence that he is a "corner spacer", no?


The fact is, he shot better than league average from both corners. Sorry if you refuse to accept that stone cold fact.

quote:

And if he was such a good corner shooter, who OK'd him taking 211 shots from the top of the key at a 32% clip?


This has nothing to do with his corner percentages and is just you trying to be an argumentative cunt.

quote:

Why not run plays to set him up for the corner 3?


Because for the majority of the year, he was the only capable ball-handler on the floor. He can't drive the lane and dish to himself in the corner.






Back to top
corndeaux
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Member since Sep 2009
5338 posts

re: Analyzing Pelican Players and How to Fit Talents Together


It's a very small sample size to jump to the conclusion that he is a great corner three shooter, but it does offer a bit of hope that he could become a threat from those spots.

It's not impossible for a guy to improve his shot, just takes good coaching and a ton of work.






Back to top
  Replies (0)
tgr4ever
LSU Fan
Atlanta
Member since Jul 2011
10678 posts
 Online 

re: Analyzing Pelican Players and How to Fit Talents Together


quote:






Jesus that is so bad. All I can do is laugh.























































Back to top
  Replies (0)
corndeaux
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Member since Sep 2009
5338 posts

re: Analyzing Pelican Players and How to Fit Talents Together


Here's what I got:

Vasquez: Le Pa 3 Md Rb
Gordon: Pa ST 3 Fe Od Sc Md
Aminu: St OD % Rb Bk
Davis: St Fe % Rb ID Bk
Lopez: Md % Po Rb ID Bk
Anderson: Le 3 Sc Md % Rb
Rivers: Pa Fe Od
Smiht: Le Fe Md % Rb ID Bk
Roberts: Pa 3 Md

Le: 3
Pa: 4
St: 2
3: 3
Fe: 2
OD: 4
Sc: 2
Md: 6
%: 5
Po: 1
Rb: 6
ID: 3
Bk: 4

Best 5 of Vasquez/Gordon/Aminu/Anderson/Davis:

Le: 2
Pa: 2
St: 3
3: 3
Fe: 2
OD: 2
Sc: 2
Md: 3
%: 3
PO: 0
Rb: 3
ID: 1
Bk: 2






Back to top
GynoSandberg
LA-Lafayette Fan
Member since Jan 2006
34248 posts
 Online 

re: Analyzing Pelican Players and How to Fit Talents Together


My my, so defensive. Good to see you are able to hold a discussion without calling someone the c word





Back to top
Jester
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Feb 2006
17459 posts

re: Analyzing Pelican Players and How to Fit Talents Together


quote:

Here's what I got:

Vasquez: Le Pa 3 Md Rb
Gordon: Pa ST 3 Fe Od Sc Md
Aminu: St OD % Rb Bk
Davis: St Fe % Rb ID Bk
Lopez: Md % Po Rb ID Bk
Anderson: Le 3 Sc Md % Rb
Rivers: Pa Fe Od
Smiht: Le Fe Md % Rb ID Bk
Roberts: Pa 3 Md

Le: 3
Pa: 4
St: 2
3: 3
Fe: 2
OD: 4
Sc: 2
Md: 6
%: 5
Po: 1
Rb: 6
ID: 3
Bk: 4

Best 5 of Vasquez/Gordon/Aminu/Anderson/Davis:

Le: 2
Pa: 2
St: 3
3: 3
Fe: 2
OD: 2
Sc: 2
Md: 3
%: 3
PO: 0
Rb: 3
ID: 1
Bk: 2



Pretty legit. I'm hoping Davis can approve his offensive numbers to balance us in the post.






Back to top
  Replies (0)
Jester
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Feb 2006
17459 posts

re: Analyzing Pelican Players and How to Fit Talents Together


quote:

My my, so defensive. Good to see you are able to hold a discussion without calling someone the c word


The discussion was going quite swimmingly until you appeared. Was it not? I rest my case.






Back to top
GynoSandberg
LA-Lafayette Fan
Member since Jan 2006
34248 posts
 Online 

re: Analyzing Pelican Players and How to Fit Talents Together


I brought up valid points. Corndeaux seemed to understand that, Im not sure why you were so defensive towards it.


27 of GV's 1012 field goal attempts in 2013 came from the corner 3. Quite a sample size, eh?

I guess you're telling me Roger Mason is a better 3P shooter than the likes of Dirk, Klay Thompson, Kyrie Irving, Ryan Anderson, James Harden because his 3P% is better? Amount of attempts nonwithstanding...






Back to top
Jester
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Feb 2006
17459 posts

re: Analyzing Pelican Players and How to Fit Talents Together


quote:

I brought up valid points. Corndeaux seemed to understand that, Im not sure why you were so defensive towards it.


I understood the points and discussed them. Your tone drove my tone.






Back to top
rzd30
Loyola-MD Fan
New Orleans
Member since Dec 2008
912 posts

re: Analyzing Pelican Players and How to Fit Talents Together


Great tool and exactly how the principle of MoneyBall worked on the baseball side.





Back to top
corndeaux
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Member since Sep 2009
5338 posts

re: Analyzing Pelican Players and How to Fit Talents Together


Article from Sports on Earth today about what the Heat are doing in reference to Shoals/Ziller, positional revolution, and the Z Chart.

Longish read, but well worth it if you find the premise of this thread interesting.

LINK

quote:

"I started wondering," Shoals recounted, "if there wasn't something bigger going on when there were individual KGs and Dirks and teams like the Wizards where interplay took precedence over a fixed system." This notion of interplay over rigidity comes up a lot in writing about the Positional Revolution, and it's also crucial to the way the Heat play basketball.


quote:

Ziller told me that the purpose of the "Z" charts was to illustrate that a lot of current NBA stars confound positionality--point guards who are good at "shooting guard things," power forwards who are good at "point guard things"--and to emphasize that the "pure" player isn't inherently more valuable. All you need is a collection of players who can pool their skills together to give you everything you need to win basketball games, positionality be damned.


quote:

Not that orthodox positionality is dead...There will probably always be good teams with 7-footers and pass-first point guards. Rather, the Heat are a novelty, and novelties are useful because they force conventional wisdom - which is not just annoying but intellectually stifling -- to justify itself in a manner it normally isn't required to. The recitation of old clichés -- defense wins championships, good pitching beats good hitting -- don't help us grow or learn. When a team comes along and wins in a new and unexpected way, it compels us to interrogate The Way Things Are rather than just accepting it as a given.






Back to top
  Replies (0)
Jester
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Feb 2006
17459 posts

re: Analyzing Pelican Players and How to Fit Talents Together


Bump. I'm going to start pulling this info over into the prospect thread





Back to top
corndeaux
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Member since Sep 2009
5338 posts

re: Analyzing Pelican Players and How to Fit Talents Together


Bump.

There will be some other pieces added, but this core looks pretty set. Time to break it down and see how they fit together using this chart.






Back to top
corndeaux
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Member since Sep 2009
5338 posts

re: Analyzing Pelican Players and How to Fit Talents Together


Returning rotation players:

Gordon: Pa ST 3 Fe Od Sc Md
Davis: St Fe % Rb ID Bk
Anderson: Le 3 Sc Md % Rb
Rivers: Pa Fe Od
Smiht: Le Fe Md % Rb ID Bk

Additions:

Holiday: Le Pa ST 3 Od Sc Md
Evans: Pa St Fe Od Sc % Rb


How does that look for Holiday and Evans? A couple of ones I struggled with were Po- both guys can post up with success but make their money on the perimeter- Evans as a 3, and Holiday in the Rb category.

For reference, we had Vasquez and Lopez as

Vasquez: Le Pa 3 Md Rb
Lopez: Md % Po Rb ID Bk

A best 5 of Holiday, Gordon, Evans, Anderson, Davis looks like this:

Le: 2
Pa: 3
St: 4
3: 3
Fe: 3
Od: 3
Sc: 4
Md: 3
%: 3
Po: 0
Rb: 3
Id: 1
Bk: 1

The perimeter D is much, much better. Even expecting a vet backup big to come on board, it looks like they will be relying on Davis to anchor the middle this season. No threat in the post on offense, but that's sort of the trend in the NBA these days.

Thoughts? Is this a reasonable account?






Back to top
  Replies (0)


Back to top