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Les' constant meddling or bad OC hires in general?

Posted on 12/8/16 at 7:58 am
Posted by oleheat
Sportsman's Paradise
Member since Mar 2007
13433 posts
Posted on 12/8/16 at 7:58 am
Which do you blame more for our consistent troubles surrounding our passing offense/QB development? It would sure seem like the former- as our ex-OCs largely had success elsewhere....
Posted by Dire Wolf
bawcomville
Member since Sep 2008
36587 posts
Posted on 12/8/16 at 8:06 am to
Les hired people he could meddle with
Posted by Topwater Trout
Red Stick
Member since Oct 2010
67589 posts
Posted on 12/8/16 at 8:08 am to
Miles
Posted by Tiger Voodoo
Champs 03 07 09 11(fack) 19!!!
Member since Mar 2007
21782 posts
Posted on 12/8/16 at 8:13 am to
quote:

Les hired people he could meddle with



Such a false narrative.

Les' offensive hires at LSU:

Retained Jimbo.
Hired long term OC and HC Crowton
Hired former OC Studrawa
Brought in Billy Gonzales to help passing game
Hired former OC and HC Kragthorpe
Brought in Adam Henry and Frank Wilson
Hired former OC and HC Cameron
Brought in Grimes
Brought in Craig and Juluke


Miles NEVER brought in yes men.

Some worked out better than others for different reasons but he always brought in highly successful and proven guys from various different philosophies and never went cheap

Posted by ThaGenius
Cenla
Member since Jul 2013
652 posts
Posted on 12/8/16 at 8:17 am to
Explain why from Studrawa to the day he got fired the offense looked exactly the same. I blame the Parkinson's, who knows what the offense would have looked like if Krags would've had his chance.
Posted by oleheat
Sportsman's Paradise
Member since Mar 2007
13433 posts
Posted on 12/8/16 at 8:22 am to
quote:

Explain why from Studrawa to the day he got fired the offense looked exactly the same. I blame the Parkinson's, who knows what the offense would have looked like if Krags would've had his chance.


I liked Les Miles a lot, and appreciate all the good things he brought to the program. But what you pointed out is impossible to deny.
Sooner or later, you have to look at the common denominator.
Posted by BBJ
BR
Member since Apr 2012
1365 posts
Posted on 12/8/16 at 8:24 am to
quote:

Which do you blame more for our consistent troubles surrounding our passing offense/QB development? It would sure seem like the former- as our ex-OCs largely had success elsewhere....
Posted by caliegeaux
Member since Aug 2004
10124 posts
Posted on 12/8/16 at 8:41 am to
quote:

I liked Les Miles a lot, and appreciate all the good things he brought to the program. But what you pointed out is impossible to deny. Sooner or later, you have to look at the common denominator.


Kind of where I've been. Strongly supported and fought to defend Miles from 2005-2011/12. After that, it has been hard to deny that he was trending down in a major way. It almost got to the point during\after the Wisky game that I forgot all the good he had done because I was so pissed at that the lack of offense in that game. Season felt wasted from that moment on, and I started to dislike him. lol

Posted by ThaGenius
Cenla
Member since Jul 2013
652 posts
Posted on 12/8/16 at 8:43 am to
I still like him as a man. He's a great person, strange as hell, but a genuinely good person. If he wasn't so stubborn I would have loved to keep him. But he lacked the ability to evolve with the game and he had to go.
Posted by Tiger Voodoo
Champs 03 07 09 11(fack) 19!!!
Member since Mar 2007
21782 posts
Posted on 12/8/16 at 8:45 am to
Yeah I'm not defending Miles or the offense, just pointing out that saying he specifically brought in guys that he could meddle with is just a dumb statement.

Whether he ended up meddling or not, the hires at the time they were made looked like great moves bringing in big names designed to bring the offense out of whatever rut it was stuck in at the time.
This post was edited on 12/8/16 at 8:51 am
Posted by SammyTiger
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Feb 2009
66344 posts
Posted on 12/8/16 at 8:47 am to
Both

I think Miles would tell them "hey tighten up we're running the ball"

But none of them were great OCs on their own (post Jimbo at least)
Posted by WPBTiger
Parts Unknown
Member since Nov 2011
30876 posts
Posted on 12/8/16 at 9:37 am to
quote:

Miles
quote:

Sooner or later, you have to look at the common denominator
Posted by jrodLSUke
Premium
Member since Jan 2011
22059 posts
Posted on 12/8/16 at 9:43 am to
Bad and unlucky OC hires.

Crowton - couldn't sustain long term success.
Krags - poor guy got sick.
Stud - inherited one of the best teams in college football history; it was just hard to make a move at OC after that 2011 season.
Cam - should have been a great hire; couldn't transition back to the college game.
Posted by Cadello
Eunice
Member since Dec 2007
47793 posts
Posted on 12/8/16 at 9:44 am to
Was wondering when we'd get around to blaming Miles
Posted by biglego
Ask your mom where I been
Member since Nov 2007
76173 posts
Posted on 12/8/16 at 9:58 am to
What's most odd to me is Crowton clearly had free rein in 2007 and it was the offense that won that NC. So after the bad 2008 experience Les decides NEVER to let the OC do his job again? Not even a different OC? The offense looked like a puckered a-hole from 2009-now, with the anomaly of that NFL talented roster in 2013. I suppose Les decided Strong defense and running game will get him 9-11 wins every year and that's good enough.
Posted by Dire Wolf
bawcomville
Member since Sep 2008
36587 posts
Posted on 12/8/16 at 11:16 am to
quote:

Some worked out better than others for different reasons but he always brought in highly successful and proven guys from various different philosophies and never went cheap



Outside of Crowton, none of those guys listed do anything prove my point false.

I cannot speak for Kragthorpe because we never saw it but Stud and Cameron obviously shared a similar vision as Miles. This, in my opinion, is bringing in yes-men. Miles wasn't going to bring in someone young that would challenge is pre-conceived notions.

As for Kragthorpe, it isn't like his offense's at Louisville were blowing the doors off people. His last year they were 71 in score offense. His last period as an OC was A&M in the late 90s, they ran a very similar offense back then.

I am not concerned with Les' hiring of position coaches and recruiters.

There was no philosophy change in LSU's style from 2010 to 2016. Outside of one year with 2 stud NFL WRs, NFL RB and a QB with a massive cannon, the offense was terrible. 2011 was good but that was a function of an elite defense staying off the field. Props to him bringing in that talent but an offense that rely solely on elite talent will struggle in down years.
This post was edited on 12/8/16 at 11:21 am
Posted by BayouBengals18
Fort Worth
Member since Jan 2009
9843 posts
Posted on 12/8/16 at 11:20 am to
Go look at Cam Cameron's resume. There's no way you can convince me he all of a sudden just forgot how to coach QB's when he got here.
Posted by Oddibe
Close to some, further from others
Member since Sep 2015
6565 posts
Posted on 12/8/16 at 11:41 am to
quote:

Go look at Cam Cameron's resume. There's no way you can convince me he all of a sudden just forgot how to coach QB's when he got here.
I have said over and over again that Cameron's offense with Ravens was called one of the most antiquated offenses in the NFL.

They were a heavy running team that also liked to throw the deep ball. Ran the fewest 3 wide receiver sets in the NFL and the most 2 TE sets in the NFL. It's extremely hard to take a spread qb and turn them into a pro-style dropback passer.
Posted by oleheat
Sportsman's Paradise
Member since Mar 2007
13433 posts
Posted on 12/8/16 at 12:12 pm to
quote:

Was wondering when we'd get around to blaming Miles


I admit I overlooked a lot. But in a time when even the most headstrong, control-freak coaches were willing to adapt in order to stay relevant offensively,
he...just...would...not...do...it.

And then it went from occasionally biting us in the arse, to regularly biting us in the arse. And that was that.

This post was edited on 12/8/16 at 12:14 pm
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