2003 LSU vs 2011 LSU
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re: 2003 LSU vs 2011 LSU
Posted by Tiger Voodoo on 4/1 at 10:38 am to GeauxTigerTM
quote:

2003 lost at home to a Ron Zook coached Florida team lead by a true freshman QB who beat them by throwing over the middle time after time.



Amazing how the last game is the only one that matters to some people. That 03 loss to a shitty arse 5 loss Zook team AT HOME in a game we didn't score a single offensive point and got torched by a freshman QB is so much more embarrassing than losing a rematch to one of the best defensive teams of all time after we beat them the first time on the road.

How some people can't see that is just beyond me.

But the haters continue to call Miles "lucky". It's hilarious. Miles is the most UNLUCKY coach of all time. Saban on the other hand, as great as he is, dude has never had a bad draw in his career.

Sure it's great that 03 ended with a trophy, but pretending Miles is the only coach to have a team, even a great team, get embarrassed in a game is funny.


This post was edited on 4/1 at 10:48 am

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Posted by ATLTiger on 4/1 at 10:53 am to Tiger Voodoo
quote:

That 03 loss to a shitty arse 5 loss Zook team AT HOME in a game we didn't score a single offensive point and got torched by a freshman QB is so much more embarrassing than losing a rematch to one of the best defensive teams of all time after we beat them the first time on the road


1/9/12 is more embarrassing IMO. and I'm talking the shutout moreso than the loss. that was the NC game, with a month to prepare, and we looked like absolute trash on offense. no attempt to at least try to change QBs when Jordan had looked horrific the previous game as well. I'm not a Les "hater", I think he's a damn good coach, I just think he didn't have much of a gameplan that day on offense, and not much to fall back on when things went bad.

the loss to UF was a letdown game if ever there was one (post UGA), and the next week we turned to the freshman RBs and never really looked back. that game was more a turning point for our offense and helped us define that side of the ball for the remainder of the year.



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Posted by N.O. via West-Cal on 4/1 at 11:03 am to ATLTiger
"
the loss to UF was a letdown game if ever there was one (post UGA), and the next week we turned to the freshman RBs and never really looked back. that game was more a turning point for our offense and helped us define that side of the ball for the remainder of the year.

Not "hatin'" or "lovin'" on anybody, but I do agree with this analysis. If one wants to say that something more pro-Miles, I would say that the 2003 UF loss was worse than either of the triple OT setbacks the 2007 team had.



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Posted by Tiger Voodoo on 4/1 at 11:11 am to ATLTiger
quote:

the loss to UF was a letdown game if ever there was one (post UGA), and the next week we turned to the freshman RBs and never really looked back. that game was more a turning point for our offense and helped us define that side of the ball for the remainder of the year.



Not accurate. It's one of the things that bother me when people romanticize how things actually went down during the Saban era and then tend to overblow the bad times of our current coach. Not saying you're doing this intentionally but it just happens over time.

In 2003 LSU beat Georgia week 4, then went to MSU and blew them out by 35 points.

THEN we had a BYE WEEK.

Then, LSU laid the egg at home, after having TWO WEEKS to prepare for that game. ZERO points on O against a 5 loss team.

Calling UF a "letdown" game is classic revisionist history, whether it is intentional or you just forgot the details over time.

The result is still to romanticize that era.


This post was edited on 4/1 at 11:18 am

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Posted by ATLTiger on 4/1 at 11:26 am to Tiger Voodoo
ah, my bad. memory's off. I just remember my asking my Source Close to the Team wtf happened after UF. he told me he thought everyone had been patting the team on the back too much after beating UGA and being undefeated, and they seemed to have lost focus. thought it was the very next game.


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Posted by Tiger Voodoo on 4/1 at 11:32 am to ATLTiger
quote:

ah, my bad. memory's off. I just remember my asking my Source Close to the Team wtf happened after UF. he told me he thought everyone had been patting the team on the back too much after beating UGA and being undefeated, and they seemed to have lost focus.



See, and I actually buy that.

It makes sense. Getting the big W against UGA with Gameday on campus and then crushing MSU, I bet the team spent that bye week telling themselves how great they were.

But that makes 1/9 understandable to me for the same reason.

People were calling 2011 LSU possibly the BEST TEAM OF ALL TIME.

We crushed EVERYONE except Bama, but had already BEATEN them. On the road no less. Beat them twice in a row and now got to play them in The Dome??? And instead of two weeks, 2011 had A MONTH to pat themselves on the back for going 13-0 against the toughest schedule in NCAA history.

That team must have been on a high like no other thinking they were about to get their coronation like the 03 and 07 teams did in The Dome.

NO WAY we could lose there right??

It's just a real shame that the team didn't have a team like OSU or Stanford to prepare for and not think that they could just repeat 11/5 and walk away with the trophy.


This post was edited on 4/1 at 11:34 am

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Posted by Child of the Missip on 4/1 at 11:56 am to Choot em Tiger
quote:

Rushing attack in 2011 was better IMO


Lolololololololol.

The 03 team was the best team I have ever seen at LSU in my life. The D was indescribably good. And the offense was balanced well. Not to mention our running backs were probably equivalent to the Mark Ingram/Trent Richardson tandem.


This post was edited on 4/1 at 12:02 pm

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Posted by The312 on 4/1 at 11:58 am to Stingray
2003 Tigers win the series 7-3.


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Posted by 0jersey on 4/1 at 12:09 pm to The312
2011 wins at least 7 of 10.
The 2003 team really wasn't exposed to many mobile qbs if I remember correctly. Saban has always had issues defending mobile qbs.

Mauck was solid, but 2011 D would force turnovers, and 2011 special teams were best in school history. 2011 beat every team they faced. 2003 did not.



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Posted by Tiger Voodoo on 4/1 at 12:17 pm to Child of the Missip
quote:

03.....running backs were probably equivalent to the Mark Ingram/Trent Richardson tandem. 






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Posted by Nuts4LSU on 4/1 at 1:18 pm to Stingray
quote:

2003 LSU vs 2011 LSUThese teams play ten games against each other. What is the series record and what is the over/under for total points per game?


2011 offense would be held in check by the 2003 defense in pretty much every game. The only way 2011 scores is by defense or special teams. 2003 wouldn't score all that much, but enough. 2003 wins at least 8 and maybe all 10. I'd say average points per game would be about 21 for 2003 and about 13 for 2011.



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Posted by Nuts4LSU on 4/1 at 1:24 pm to Tiger Voodoo
quote:

That 03 loss to a shitty arse 5 loss Zook team AT HOME in a game we didn't score a single offensive point and got torched by a freshman QB


We didn't exactly get "torched" by Chris Leak. Florida only scored 19 points, and we had at least a couple of turnovers (that would have gone for scores) negated by bad referees' calls. We sacked him all day and forced fumbles but just couldn't get the calls. If a couple of those go the right way, we shake his confidence badly and win that game, IMO.

quote:

more embarrassing than losing a rematch to one of the best defensive teams of all time after we beat them the first time on the road.


Both games were pathetic no-shows. So, for embarrassment factor, it seems to come down to what the circumstances were for the games. One was an afternoon home game against a team that was reeling at the time and was a huge underdog to us, while the other was a national championship game. Which situation is more embarrassing for a team to just decide not to show up?


This post was edited on 4/1 at 1:25 pm

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Posted by GeauxTigerTM on 4/1 at 1:36 pm to ATLTiger
quote:

the loss to UF was a letdown game if ever there was one (post UGA), and the next week we turned to the freshman RBs and never really looked back.


Let me clarify this...we didn't turn to them, we were forced to play them as our previous two starters, Shy Carey and Joe Addai had gone down against MSU and Florida respectively. This wasn't some brilliant strategic move by Saban (not saying you're saying it is...but I've heard others do just that) but one in which he had no choice. The only reason Alley and Justin (and even Barrington Edwards) got those touches against USCe was because the first two options were on the shelf.

As it turned out, it was the spark we needed to go on that second half run...but had those guys not gone down there's nothing to indicate JV and Alley would have gotten any significant touches as they had not up to that point in the season behind the older guys.



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Posted by Tiger Voodoo on 4/1 at 2:09 pm to Nuts4LSU
quote:

We didn't exactly get "torched" by Chris Leak. Florida only scored 19 points, and we had at least a couple of turnovers (that would have gone for scores) negated by bad referees' calls. We sacked him all day and forced fumbles but just couldn't get the calls. If a couple of those go the right way, we shake his confidence badly and win that game, IMO.



Chris Leak 18/30 229 7.6 2 0


Maybe "torched" was a bit of a strong word, but he sure played a damn good game. Especially considering he was a freshman with very little PT playing probably LSU's best defense of all time in Tiger Stadium. And we were absolutely "torched" on those 2 TD calls. D never saw either one coming and they were the same play. No excuse for that D.



quote:

One was an afternoon home game against a team that was reeling at the time and was a huge underdog to us, while the other was a national championship game. Which situation is more embarrassing for a team to just decide not to show up?



Well, that's simplifying both "situations" a bit isn't it?

03 FL was a home game against the SEC standard bearer for the previous decade. The last time UF came into Tiger Stadium they beat ever loving frick out of LSU's SEC Champion team in the worst beat down of a good LSU team I have ever seen. Talk about embarrassment.

Then Spurrier left, and we beat them in 02 with Mauck going down at the end of a blowout, which sent that season off the rails.

The team should have wanted to win that game to flex their muscles and prove that they were the new big boys on the block. We had a legit National Title shot for the first time in 45 years and there was no indication that if we lost that game, or any game after, that we'd be able to get back into the championship picture.


2011, after going 13-0 against the toughest schedule in NCAA history, that group had the insult of having to play a team they had already beaten on the road yet again. The voters basically told them that what they had done wasn't good enough, and didn't mean anything.

If that isn't deflating as shit, I don't know what is.

Of course, they could have used the slight as motivation, and I'm sure that's what they tried to do and believed they were doing, but the ultimate disappointment probably couldn't be avoided I would guess.

It just couldn't have made much sense.

And as good a bowl game coach as Miles had been up to that point, it was certainly a new challenge getting a team prepared and focused for a month on a team that everything in their football experience would have told them was already supposed to be behind them.

Both situations had their difficulties, but teams should be more accustomed to dealing with and overcoming the adversities that the 03 team couldn't versus what the 2011 team couldn't.

That's just a historical fact.


This post was edited on 4/1 at 2:14 pm

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Posted by GeauxTigerTM on 4/1 at 3:00 pm to Tiger Voodoo
quote:

03 FL was a home game against the SEC standard bearer for the previous decade. The last time UF came into Tiger Stadium they beat ever loving frick out of LSU's SEC Champion team in the worst beat down of a good LSU team I have ever seen. Talk about embarrassment.


Not to hijack the thread, but that's another game that gets completely forgotten in the revisionism that has become Nick Saban's tenure at LSU. That 2001 date rape Steve Spurrier and Rex Grossman laid on LSU at home was just absolutely stunning. Grossman should have won the Heisman that year, and in large part because of what he did to LSU that game.

That 2001 team was just SOOO fortunate on so many levels. Had it not been for 9/11 and the subsequent postponement of the early season AU game, LSU almost certainly would not have gone 5-3 and backed themselves into the SECCG. Likewise, if not for that weekend's games being delayed, UF would have likely beaten TENN soundly as well and UF would have been waiting in Atlanta with a trip to the Rose Bowl/NCG at stake instead of TENN.



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Posted by Nuts4LSU on 4/1 at 3:04 pm to Tiger Voodoo
quote:

Well, that's simplifying both "situations" a bit isn't it? 03 FL was a home game against the SEC standard bearer for the previous decade. The last time UF came into Tiger Stadium they beat ever loving frick out of LSU's SEC Champion team in the worst beat down of a good LSU team I have ever seen. Talk about embarrassment. Then Spurrier left, and we beat them in 02 with Mauck going down at the end of a blowout, which sent that season off the rails. The team should have wanted to win that game to flex their muscles and prove that they were the new big boys on the block. We had a legit National Title shot for the first time in 45 years and there was no indication that if we lost that game, or any game after, that we'd be able to get back into the championship picture.


Or you could describe it as a home afternoon game against a big underdog we'd beaten by four touchdowns at their place the year before. I was at that game and you could feel all over campus that the energy just wasn't there like it was for the Georgia game. Even the weather was overcast and dreary. There's no excuse for it. We should have showed up to play. But not showing up for a situation like that vs. not showing up for a NC game?

quote:

2011, after going 13-0 against the toughest schedule in NCAA history, that group had the insult of having to play a team they had already beaten on the road yet again. The voters basically told them that what they had done wasn't good enough, and didn't mean anything. If that isn't deflating as shit, I don't know what is. Of course, they could have used the slight as motivation, and I'm sure that's what they tried to do and believed they were doing, but the ultimate disappointment probably couldn't be avoided I would guess. It just couldn't have made much sense.


It's a national championship game. No matter what the circumstances, you don't just not show up for it.

quote:

And as good a bowl game coach as Miles had been up to that point, it was certainly a new challenge getting a team prepared and focused for a month on a team that everything in their football experience would have told them was already supposed to be behind them. Both situations had their difficulties, but teams should be more accustomed to dealing with and overcoming the adversities that the 03 team couldn't versus what the 2011 team couldn't. That's just a historical fact.


Yes, it was a new challenge and playing in a rematch was difficult. But it's a national championship game. How do you just decide not to show up? The 2011 team just flat didn't care in the NC game. That's inexcusable. And unlike the 2003 Florida game, there was literally NO chance of getting back into the NC picture if we lost it.

It's pointless for us to sit here and say which horrible day was worse. They were both terrible. I stand by my speculation that the 2003 team would have beaten the 2011 team almost every time.


This post was edited on 4/1 at 3:05 pm

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Posted by Stingray on 4/1 at 3:44 pm to Nuts4LSU
okay, so most peoples opinions of which team was better is based on love of coach miles vs coach saban, level of tolerance of jj, and/or feelings of which is worst "not showing up" vs 2003 UF or "not showing up" vs bama in the mnc game.

please dont let me get in the way of your emotions dictating your thoughts.

BTW, 2011 wins 7-3.



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Posted by ATLTiger on 4/1 at 3:46 pm to Stingray
quote:

BTW, 2011 wins 7-3.



why?



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Posted by Stingray on 4/1 at 3:58 pm to ATLTiger
quote:

why?



Jan. 9, 2012 New Orleans, La. #1 LSU vs. #2 Alabama
BCS National Championship
Box Score
Dec. 3, 2011 Atlanta, Ga. #1 LSU 42, #12 Georgia 10
SEC Championship
Box Score
Nov. 25, 2011 Baton Rouge, La. #1 LSU 41, #3 Arkansas 17
Box Score
Nov. 19, 2011 Oxford, Miss. #1 LSU 52, Ole Miss 3
Box Score
Nov. 12, 2011 Baton Rouge, La. #1 LSU 42, Western Kentucky 9
Box Score
Nov. 5, 2011 Tuscaloosa, Ala. #1 LSU 9, #2 Alabama 6 (OT)
Box Score
Oct. 22, 2011 Baton Rouge, La. #1 LSU 45, #19 Auburn 10
Box Score
Oct. 15, 2011 Knoxville, Tenn. #1 LSU 38, Tennessee 7
Box Score
Oct. 8, 2011 Baton Rouge, La. #1 LSU 41, #17 Florida 11
Box Score
Oct. 1, 2011 Baton Rouge, La. #1 LSU 35, Kentucky 7
Box Score
Sept. 24, 2011 Morgantown, W.Va. #2 LSU 47, #16 West Virginia 21
Box Score
Sept. 15, 2011 Starkville, Miss #3 LSU 19, #25 Mississippi St. 6
Box Score
Sept. 10, 2011 Baton Rouge, La. #2 LSU 49, Northwestern St. 3
Box Score
Sept. 3, 2011 Arlington, Texas #4 LSU 40, #3 Oregon 27
Cowboys Classic
Box Score

Jan. 4, 2004 New Orleans, La. #2 LSU 21, #1 Oklahoma 14
2004 Nokia Sugar Bowl
2003 BCS National Championship Game
Box Score
Dec. 6, 2003 Atlanta, Ga. #3 LSU 34, #5 Georgia 13
SEC Championship
Box Score
Nov. 28, 2003 Baton Rouge, La. #3 LSU 55, Arkansas 24
Box Score
Nov. 22, 2003 Oxford, Miss. #3 LSU 17, #15 Ole Miss 14
Box Score
Nov. 15, 2003 Tuscaloosa, Ala. #3 LSU 27, Alabama 3
Box Score
Nov. 1, 2003 Baton Rouge, La. #7 LSU 49, Louisiana Tech 10 (HC)
Box Score
Oct. 25, 2003 Baton Rouge, La. #9 LSU 31, #17 Auburn 7
Box Score
Oct. 18, 2003 Columbia, S.C. #10 LSU 33, South Carolina 7
Box Score
Oct. 11, 2003 Baton Rouge, La. Florida 19, #6 LSU 7
Box Score
Sept. 27, 2003 Starkville, Miss. #7 LSU 41, Mississippi State 6
Box Score
Sept. 20, 2003 Baton Rouge, La. #11 LSU 17, #7 Georgia 10
Box Score
Sept. 13, 2003 Baton Rouge, La. #11 LSU 35, Western Illinois 7
Box Score
Sept. 6, 2003 Tucson, Ariz. #13 LSU 59, Arizona 13
Box Score
Aug. 30, 2003 Baton Rouge, La. #14 LSU 49, UL-Monroe 7
Box Score



Look at the rankings of the opponents.




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Posted by Tiger Voodoo on 4/1 at 4:05 pm to Nuts4LSU
quote:

*Nuts4LSU*



All great points dude. Fun discussion on a fun topic.


As for your feeling that 03 wins every time, I still disagree.

I think both teams were pretty equal, but like another poster said, put Mauck on 11 and they win 10-0 imo. That's how dominant the 11 D and ST were imo.

QB was 03s one clear advantage, but Mauck was certainly capable of laying an egg against good defenses, even average defenses actually, and 11s D was absolutely great.

He would have choked away a pick six or something probably close to every other game and that would be lights out against the 2011 D.



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