I ask again. Who on Earth is actually going to pay insurance premiums?
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I ask again. Who on Earth is actually going to pay insurance premiums?
Posted by ShortyRob on 10/16 at 3:26 pm
I mean, seriously. Even for lefties who support the program, what percentage of not currently sick people will actually pay for insurance in cases where the fine is less than the premium?

I mean, from an intelligent move perpective, that percentage should be 0%. I would pretty much expect nearly every soul who sees fines as less than 75% of their potential premium will choose fines.

I mean, why not? You don't actually NEED insurance when you aren't sick and, if you get sick, you can literally buy it tomorrow. Functionally, how on Earth is that going to work? The program relies upon healthy people paying the premiums.

Would YOU pay the premium? If so, why?


This post was edited on 10/16 at 3:27 pm

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Posted by JawjaTigah on 10/16 at 3:28 pm to ShortyRob
quote:

I would pretty much expect nearly every soul who sees fines as less than 75% of their potential premium will choose fines.
So in a really convoluted way, this really is a tax by another name. BTW, does anybody know where the fine proceeds go?



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Posted by constant cough on 10/16 at 3:29 pm to JawjaTigah
quote:

So in a really convoluted way, this really is a tax by another name.



No it's actually called a tax, John Roberts said so.



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Posted by GumboPot on 10/16 at 3:29 pm to ShortyRob
quote:

insurance premiums?


What's that?


Seriously, just sign up to avoid the penalty then don't pay.



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Posted by ShortyRob on 10/16 at 3:33 pm to GumboPot
quote:

Seriously, just sign up to avoid the penalty then don't pay.


Hmm. Wonder how they track that? Maybe sign up and pay one month of premium. Then get past the penalty and stop paying.

Rinse repeat the following year ad infinitum. The bureacracy required to chase this shite down is gonna be hilarious!!!



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Posted by Zed on 10/16 at 3:36 pm to ShortyRob
quote:

I mean, seriously. Even for lefties who support the program, what percentage of not currently sick people will actually pay for insurance in cases where the fine is less than the premium?
If the subsidies knock their premiums down to an affordable level, and they're responsible people, they'll get insurance.
quote:

if you get sick, you can literally buy it tomorrow
From what I understand, this isn't the case. Aren't there limited opportunities to enroll each year?



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Posted by Godfather1 on 10/16 at 3:36 pm to ShortyRob
I plan on keeping my work plan for as long as its tenable. You never know when something will happen.

We're switching from Aetna to Anthem after the first of the year. I guess I'll see what the difference will be.



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Posted by Hog on the Hill on 10/16 at 3:36 pm to ShortyRob
quote:

if you get sick, you can literally buy it tomorrow.
I thought there were enrollment periods each year and that if you didn't enroll during those periods then you have to wait until the next year. Unless you have a qualifying life event, like marriage or birth of a child, in which case you can change your enrollment. Is that not true?

If it is true, then it would prevent abuse of the system like you mentioned.

This is exactly how it works for my employer-subsidized insurance. If you don't enroll in time, then you get sick, then you have 100% fricked yourself.

edit: It's true. The open enrollment period will be October 15 to December 7. If you want to enroll for 2016, you must enroll between 10/15/2015 and 12/6/2015. If you don't, then get crippled in a car accident and need multiple surgeries, then you have screwed yourself.

Source: LINK /


This post was edited on 10/16 at 3:43 pm

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Posted by Oenophile Brah on 10/16 at 3:38 pm to Hog on the Hill
quote:

I thought there were enrollment periods each year and that if you didn't enroll during those periods then you have to wait until the next year

I believe this to be true.

My question turns to, what happens when someone walks into the hospital without insurance?

Aren't we right back in the same boat????



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Posted by Five0 on 10/16 at 3:40 pm to JawjaTigah
quote:

BTW, does anybody know where the fine proceeds go?












































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Posted by JawjaTigah on 10/16 at 3:41 pm to constant cough
quote:

So in a really convoluted way, this really is a tax by another name.

No it's actually called a tax, John Roberts said so.

No kidding? Oh... but that's why I said what I said the way I said it. It was a convoluted ruling by the SCOTUS, and with the fines in lieu of the premiums, it truly amounts to really being a tax. Just by another name.



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Posted by Hog on the Hill on 10/16 at 3:41 pm to Oenophile Brah
quote:

My question turns to, what happens when someone walks into the hospital without insurance?

Aren't we right back in the same boat????
The hospital has to evaluate and stabilize your condition but they aren't obligated to do everything that would benefit you. For instance, they might have to set your broken arm, but they don't have to go to any great length to make sure you fully recover from your injury. If you need physical therapy, you're shite out of luck.

edit: and ERs are only required to take action for emergency conditions. That doesn't mean you can use them for any old thing.


This post was edited on 10/16 at 3:44 pm

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Posted by Oenophile Brah on 10/16 at 3:43 pm to Hog on the Hill
quote:

The hospital has to evaluate and stabilize your condition but they aren't obligated to do everything that would benefit you

Not sure where you're getting that info but I'll play along.

Who pays for that?

What if someone is has terminal illness and no insurance? Left to die on the street?



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Posted by Zed on 10/16 at 3:44 pm to Oenophile Brah
quote:

My question turns to, what happens when someone walks into the hospital without insurance?
With the tax penalty they'll be paying every year without insurance, they will have at least provide some funds towards their inevitable emergency room visits.



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Posted by SquatchDawg on 10/16 at 3:44 pm to ShortyRob
quote:

Would YOU pay the premium? If so, why?


The only way this whole thing would actually work is if you get turned away at the hospital/doctor for not having insurance. Then everyone would sign up. We as a country though are morally ready to do stuff like this (not yet anyway).

Otherwise, it's jsut a very clever way to data mine the bottom 30% out there via the Obamacare Enrollment site for fundraising purposes.



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Posted by SpidermanTUba on 10/16 at 3:45 pm to ShortyRob
quote:

I mean, seriously. Even for lefties who support the program, what percentage of not currently sick people will actually pay for insurance in cases where the fine is less than the premium?

I mean, from an intelligent move perpective, that percentage should be 0%. I would pretty much expect nearly every soul who sees fines as less than 75% of their potential premium will choose fines.

I mean, why not? You don't actually NEED insurance when you aren't sick and, if you get sick, you can literally buy it tomorrow. Functionally, how on Earth is that going to work? The program relies upon healthy people paying the premiums.

Would YOU pay the premium? If so, why?



You should ask this question of the people of Massachusetts who already liver under such a system.

You should also google "preventive medicine"


This post was edited on 10/16 at 3:47 pm

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Posted by Hog on the Hill on 10/16 at 3:46 pm to Oenophile Brah
quote:

Not sure where you're getting that info but I'll play along.

Who pays for that?

What if someone is has terminal illness and no insurance? Left to die on the street?
Like cancer? Yeah pretty much, ERs are not required to provide cancer therapy to anyone, as far as I know. If you go in with superior vena cava syndrome (tumor growing that is compressing the superior vena cava, a painful and eventually fatal condition) then they will probably have to help you, but I don't know to what extent they are obligated to treat you. I strongly doubt they are going to put you on chemo if you can't pay for it. They might have to give you emergency radiation therapy, which would delay the inevitable.

I could be wrong because I am not an ER professional, I work in oncology, and I only deal with patients once they've already consulted with their oncologist.

edit: and I'm posting from my office when I should be going home for the day, so I'm about to head out


This post was edited on 10/16 at 3:49 pm

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Posted by Oenophile Brah on 10/16 at 3:47 pm to Zed
quote:

With the tax penalty they'll be paying every year without insurance, they will have at least provide some funds towards their inevitable emergency room visits.

I'm sorry but this is laughable.

You think the tiny tax the government is levying will cover that tab? Not a prayer.



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Posted by wickowick on 10/16 at 3:47 pm to Zed
quote:

If the subsidies knock their premiums down to an affordable level


Who is paying the deductible?



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Posted by SpidermanTUba on 10/16 at 3:48 pm to SquatchDawg
quote:


The only way this whole thing would actually work is if you get turned away at the hospital/doctor for not having insurance. Then everyone would sign up. We as a country though are morally ready to do stuff like this (not yet anyway).


Please tell me you understand that if you incur emergency medical expenses today, buying insurance tomorrow isn't going to cover those expenses. PLEASE tell me you get this. Pre-existing conditions are covered, not pre-existing expenses.



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