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re: If Brock Bowers or Rome Odunze are still on the board at 14, do you take one of them?
Posted on 4/6/24 at 8:18 pm to Townedrunkard
Posted on 4/6/24 at 8:18 pm to Townedrunkard
quote:
If Bowers is a bust, I’d be shocked.
A higher chance Bowers is a bust more than a OT we draft. Yes Bowers is an amazing TE prospect but again how many of those guys have translated to becoming amazing NFL pros? The fact is that if Bowers is sooo amazing yet there is a chance he might drop to 14- that should tell you something.
3
Posted on 4/6/24 at 8:19 pm to Pels_Yaz
quote:
The fact is that if Bowers is sooo amazing yet there is a chance he might drop to 14- that should tell you something.
Posted on 4/6/24 at 8:21 pm to Chalkywhite84
quote:
While I do think they draft ot, they could put a bandaid on tackle and draft bowers. Grab a guy like Charles Leno, peat, or Donovan smith.
Lol with Derek Carr as your qb? Do some of you realize how important OT is? If as a fan you didn’t learn that last year- that you cant just band-aid that position, I don’t know what to say.
Posted on 4/6/24 at 8:33 pm to Chalkywhite84
quote:
Problem is Bowers isn't just any tight end. He is doing things that have never been done. He hasn't just done them for 1 year either. Bowers has been elite for 3 years straight.
Scheme has a lot to do with this. Bowers caught a crazy 48 % of his passes behind the line of scrimmage. Out of all the first round TEs drafted in that range the closest in that category was 22%. Why is this important?
Well first it shows half of his catches were schemed catches not ones caught in defensive traffic. Second, most NFL teams will not be throwing to their TE behind the line of scrimmage. This is not to say Bowers isnt talented- its just lets keep things in perspective when people say he isn’t “just any TE.”
Posted on 4/6/24 at 9:06 pm to Pels_Yaz
quote:
The fact is that if Bowers is sooo amazing yet there is a chance he might drop to 14- that should tell you something.
Every draft is different. Lattimore was by far and away the best DB in his draft and fell to 11. Micah Parsons was considered an elite prospect and fell to 12. Elite talents slip all the time.
Like some others have said, I’d be shocked if Bowers is a bust. His game translates to the NFL perfectly.
This post was edited on 4/6/24 at 9:10 pm
Posted on 4/6/24 at 9:12 pm to jamal
quote:
This isn’t always a good way to look at things. Every drastic different. Lattimore was by far and away the best DB in his draft and fell to 11. Micah Parsons was considered an elite prospect and fell to 12. Elite talents slip all the time.
Of course they do. But tons of guys that fall and bust out too. Im just saying Bowers isn’t some crazy top pick you can not pass on guy- that people are making him out to be.
Posted on 4/6/24 at 9:14 pm to Pels_Yaz
if the Saints could run the ball better that would open things a lot more. problem is they were behind in some very important games in that middle part of the season.
And there are questions at RB if we're being honest. But if Kubiak can bring more balance to this the offense, great! I think the special teams could be good enough to steal a game or two if kicks are made and the return game is there.
They haven't really made many moves on the O-line other than the guy from the Vikings forgot his name. If they double down on the O-line with the first 2 picks, then they need to get the frick out!
And there are questions at RB if we're being honest. But if Kubiak can bring more balance to this the offense, great! I think the special teams could be good enough to steal a game or two if kicks are made and the return game is there.
They haven't really made many moves on the O-line other than the guy from the Vikings forgot his name. If they double down on the O-line with the first 2 picks, then they need to get the frick out!
Posted on 4/6/24 at 9:37 pm to Pels_Yaz
quote:
? The fact is that if Bowers is sooo amazing yet there is a chance he might drop to 14- that should tell you something.
The irony of this statement in the big picture, especially since you're pushing OT and not the safest 1st round positional pick.
Posted on 4/6/24 at 9:38 pm to Pels_Yaz
quote:
Do some of you realize how important OT is?
The bigger picture is the OL as a unit.
quote:
If as a fan you didn’t learn that last year- that you cant just band-aid that position,
Plenty of really good/elite teams do, though, every year.
Posted on 4/6/24 at 9:39 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Plenty of really good/elite teams do, though, every year.
We are no where near an ELITE team thats the issue.
Posted on 4/6/24 at 9:40 pm to Pels_Yaz
quote:
. But tons of guys that fall and bust out too.
You're so concerned with busts but aren't even pushing the safest 1st round position. Why?
Powers-Johnson has over a 90% chance to not be a bust. Much higher than OT.
quote:
Bowers isn’t some crazy top pick you can not pass on guy
He's about as safe as it gets in terms of prospects.
Posted on 4/6/24 at 9:41 pm to Pels_Yaz
quote:
We are no where near an ELITE team thats the issue.
Then we need to look for the most elite talent and not the safest or a need.
Posted on 4/6/24 at 9:42 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
The irony of this statement in the big picture, especially since you're pushing OT and not the safest 1st round positional pick.
It’s because this teams need is desperate at OT and its much safer than a high prospect TE.
Posted on 4/6/24 at 9:45 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Then we need to look for the most elite talent and not the safest or a need.
You just promoted band-aiding the OT position because elite teams do. Now you agree Saints arent elite and just want to draft an elite talent because again for you the need in other positions just dont matter. Name me a team that drafted a high prospect TE and it made them elite?
Posted on 4/6/24 at 9:56 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
He's about as safe as it gets in terms of prospects.
But you’re missing that drafting a high rated prospect TE position is not safe at all.
Posted on 4/6/24 at 9:56 pm to Pels_Yaz
quote:
You just promoted band-aiding the OT position because elite teams do. Now you agree Saints arent elite and just want to draft an elite talent because again for you the need in other positions just dont matter.
Why are you trying to make it sound like these 2 ideas don't work together and are creating conflict with each other?
We're not elite. All the more reason to get a cheap band aid for a year or 2 at OT.
quote:
. Name me a team that drafted a high prospect TE and it made them elite?
How does this not apply to OTs, too?
If we're rebuilding, why aren't we going for the most elite talent available at our pick?
Posted on 4/6/24 at 9:57 pm to Pels_Yaz
the Saints have a lot of holes and it's all tied together. No one seems to give a frick about the special teams signings so that's good.
Everyone ignores that group until a missed kick and then blames the fricking kicker for blowing the game when so many other things contributed as well. It's a fricking joke.
What has been done to improve the run game? Alvin was taken out of some games because of the score and the game flow. Not establishing the run really cost the Saints last season. If they start playing more from under center, that's a start to maybe getting things fixed. The defense started out well but hit a slump starting in the Packers game when they couldn't pressure Love at all and then the secondary got tired at the end.
Everyone ignores that group until a missed kick and then blames the fricking kicker for blowing the game when so many other things contributed as well. It's a fricking joke.
What has been done to improve the run game? Alvin was taken out of some games because of the score and the game flow. Not establishing the run really cost the Saints last season. If they start playing more from under center, that's a start to maybe getting things fixed. The defense started out well but hit a slump starting in the Packers game when they couldn't pressure Love at all and then the secondary got tired at the end.
This post was edited on 4/6/24 at 9:58 pm
Posted on 4/6/24 at 10:00 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
You're so concerned with busts but aren't even pushing the safest 1st round position. Why? Powers-Johnson has over a 90% chance to not be a bust. Much higher than OT.
No again missing the point. Im concerned in drafting a high prospect TE- that is historically in all senses just a bad gamble especially over a solid to elite OT prospect that fills a huge need.
Im not obsessed with busts- you’re obsessed that Bowers won’t or can’t bust. Which again would be out of the norm for a TE drafted that high. Its like you think Bowers is some sure thing at 14 that drafted any other prospect at any other position would be a waste.
Posted on 4/6/24 at 10:08 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Why are you trying to make it sound like these 2 ideas don't work together and are creating conflict with each other? We're not elite. All the more reason to get a cheap band aid for a year or 2 at OT.
You literally argued to get a band-aid at OT because elite teams do, now you’re saying we’re not elite so we should get a band aid at OT. So for you regardless of where the team is its ok to band aid the OT position. Yeah makes a lot of sense buddy.
quote:
How does this not apply to OTs, too? If we're rebuilding, why aren't we going for the most elite talent available at our pick?
Sewell and Wirfs are perfect examples of guys have solidified their positions and the oline.
Not every position in the NFL is created equal. This isn’t the NBA. Positions matter- its why QBs are always drafted higher than what they’re rated. Its why elite kickers/punters arent drafted high. Its also why if you can ask any GM in regards to positions they would rate OT much more important than a TE.
Posted on 4/6/24 at 10:20 pm to Pels_Yaz
quote:
You literally argued to get a band-aid at OT because elite teams do,
The point, which you apparently need to be spoon-fed, is that having an elite OT doesn't have a perfect correlation with winning.
IF the elite can do it, then the mediocre can, too.
You do understand this, right? It's not complicated. I can try to break it down into simpler words if you need me to.
quote:
Sewell and Wirfs are perfect examples of guys have solidified their positions and the oline.
They were elite OT prospects. We won't get a chance to draft a Sewell or Wirfs.
Hell, nobody does. No OT comes close to either this draft
quote:
Its also why if you can ask any GM in regards to positions they would rate OT much more important than a TE.
So every NFL GM had to pick a player to steal from KC, they'd pick Juwon Taylor over Kelce?
Note: The Chiefs signed Taylor. They didn't daft his predecessor, either. OTs can be acquired outside of the draft (or with non-1st draft capital). The 49ers didn't draft their LT, either. Bengals didn't draft either OT I don't believe. The Cowboys just let their LT hit FA. Dolphins signed theirs. Texans traded for their's.
This post was edited on 4/6/24 at 10:21 pm
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